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Samantha Womack's episode

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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby myrtlebird8 » Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:57 pm

How good to have a new series! And an enjoyable programme to start!

I agree about the loose ends... on Alexander's army records it gives his wife as Beatrice Winifred Pickford, married in 1908. This is not the same Beatrice as the one on the programme - the ages are wrong. But they don't seem to have been together for very long - three years later she was living with her mum (maybe that's when Alexander was in prison).

So how and when did Alexander get together with Beatrice Finkle and did they ever marry? The unfinished ends and lack of evidence have been nagging at me all day!!!
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby ksouthall » Thu Aug 16, 2012 9:30 pm

RoyMiskelly wrote:Hi, What a great start to the series but as many have said there was a lot left out and I am sure people are frantically searching the records for more info. I checked to see when Alexander Cunningham married Beatrice, if I followed it properly, and the only Beatrice I could find marrying a Ryan was in 1908 so it could not have been the Beatrice that went to America ? or am I completely up the wrong tree - pardon the pun. Did he marry twice ?


I thought it was a really good programme too.

It's a bit of a coincidence that Alexander Cunningham Ryan married two Beatrices. I'm guessing the marriage record you found in 1908 was the marriage to Beatrice Winifred Pickford on 15th August 1908 in Plymouth. This matches his military service record, dated 22nd September 1914, which declares his next of kin as Beatrice Winifred Ryan of 63 Lilford (?) Road, Camberwell. One thing is different though - he hair is now decribed as brown, whereas when he first joined the army, it had been fair.

According to the 1891 Scottish Census, Alexander's father was James William Ryan, a foundry storeman, who was born in England in about 1851. Later on, James William was living in Dublin, according to Alexander's service record. His mother, Jane, was born in Glasgow in about 1860. At one point, his mother, and his younger brothers, Peter and Michael were living in Manchester.

On the 1918 Electoral Register, Alexander Cunningham Ryan is living at 6 Neal Street, St Martin in the Fields, London.

I have found a possible probate record for Alexander. It looks like it's the right one as he was about the right age. Alexander died on 19th November, 1943. He was otherwise known as Jock Cunningham and his address was 15a Roskell Road, Putney. Probate was given to Louise Page, wife of Oliver Edward James Page. His effects were £483 5s 2d. As that's pre-decimal, I'm not sure exactly how much that makes it.

Perhaps Alexander married Beatrice Garraud abroad, if he married her at all. I will have a look and see what I can find out.
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby ksouthall » Thu Aug 16, 2012 9:32 pm

myrtlebird8 wrote:I agree about the loose ends... on Alexander's army records it gives his wife as Beatrice Winifred Pickford, married in 1908.


I'm glad you also found that too. I was typing up all the things I had found out when you posted your reply. Have you found anything out about Beatrice Garraud?
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby ksouthall » Thu Aug 16, 2012 11:54 pm

Back to Alexander's probate record, Oliver Edward James Page was born in Redhill, Surrey, in 1910. Oliver's parents were Edward Page, a compositor from Hailsham, and his wife, Caroline Charlotte Page, nee Funnell, from Chiddingly. They had married in Hailsham district in 1909.

In 1941, Oliver married Louise Gregory or Mumford in Loughborough. Louise must have been married or living with someone previously.

In 1945, Oliver married Ruby Ethel Seago in Wandsworth. Oliver died on 13th July 1966.

I don't think this helps much with finding out more about Beatrice, as the only way to find out how Alexander and Louise were connected would be to obtain a copy of Alexander's will.

However, it has been interesting for me to check out as I have discovered that Oliver was my 5th cousin twice removed on the Funnell side of my family tree. I thought he would probably be distantly related when I saw that his mother came from Chiddingly.
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby ritah » Fri Aug 17, 2012 3:08 pm

Yes an excellent first episode as others have said and what I love about the programme is that it makes us want to fill in all the gaps left unfilled.

Good luck to all those now doing the research we didn't see.

Rita
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby Ivor » Fri Aug 17, 2012 4:14 pm

I too could only find Alexander marrying Beatrice Pickford.
In the probate records 1958 there is a Beatrice Winifred Ryan SPINSTER.
Of the names mentioned Fernley Skelly had married Hilda Jewell in 1921.
1911 Census her father is Bertram Jewell and her mother is Alice Amy (nee Pickford) sister to Beatrice!
Why did no one get granny Dolly's birth certificate?
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby KayFarndon » Fri Aug 17, 2012 5:24 pm

What a fabulous beginning to the new series and if future episodes are only half as interesting it will be the best series by far. How brilliant was the research and most of it done without the aid of the census returns! I thought that Samantha was very perceptive and genuine with her responses and it showed how much she enjoyed the journey.
I feel that there is another programme about her family waiting to be told. The French side definitely: and I so wanted her to climb the steps to No 36 & a half and knock on the door and see if there were any Finkles there or still in the area.
I have a brother of my great grandmother whose death was due to accidental burning and there is no inquest report for it, so I have no idea just how he died and that really tugged at my heartstrings.
It was just brilliant and well done to the production team, as not a minute was wasted and scarcely any repetition, which often pads a programme out.
Can't wait for next week!
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby wheels » Fri Aug 17, 2012 5:53 pm

Considering they were helped by the society of genealogists the inacuracies in the show made me wonder if the rest of the series is worth watching??? I it was impossible to miss the 1908 Plymouth Marriage in fact thats the ONLY marriage that comes up on Freebmd, Ancestry or Findmypast so how and where did they arrive a Gaurand?? needs an email to points of view me thinks to get an explaination.... not only that the American link is pushing a bit as was the supposed photo of a younger brother of Alexander...
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby myrtlebird8 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:45 am

Can anyone find grandma Dolly's birth certificate? I didn't manage to! From a public tree on ancestry I gleaned that she was born Doris Cuningham-Ryan in 1926, but so far I haven't found any trace on FreeBMD.

I don't know why this programme has got to me so much - I really want to sort it out!

I guess it was grandma Dolly's oral history that led them to the Garraud name... and maybe the records just aren't there...but it's very frustrating!
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Re: Samantha Womack's episode

Postby myrtlebird8 » Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:57 am

Sorry, I have just found the birth record, and it does cite 'Garraud' as mother's maiden name. 1924.
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