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AGNES TREMLETT

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AGNES TREMLETT

Postby laughing granny » Sun Jul 11, 2010 11:25 pm

What became of Agnes?

Agnes had a son Edgar Owen Warren Tremlett who was born in the Minster Union Workhouse, Thanet, Kent in January 1888. Except for the 1901 census where he seems to be hiding we have documentation on Edgar through to his death in 1952 but his mother is a mystery we don't know where she came from and can't find a birth, marriage or death record for her.

Agnes was admitted to the workhouse on November 28th 1887 her year of birth is given as 1867-occupation cook from Birchington parish.

Both Agnes and Edgar left the workhouse on March 28th 1888. This is the last we know of Agnes.Edgar's birth certificate says that she was a cook domestic in Birchington. Could this be Quex?

In 1891 when Edgar was three years old the census tells us that he is a nurse child and is with George and Matilda Kennett at Canterbury Somalian Cottages, Thanet.

We visited these cottages on the Quex estate which leads to another mystery as these cottages were not built at the time Edgar was there so maybe there are some more Somalian cottages somewhere
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby Sylcec » Mon Jul 12, 2010 1:07 am

Geography may be an important factor for you. The parish of Birchington is on the Kent coast to the Thames estuary (it was once a chapelry of the parish of Monkton, which adjoins inland). It is likely that many sea-faring folk, or coastal traders may be settled or spent time in the parish.

Using FreeBMD I only found 3 births for a TREMLETT in Kent from 1860-1870, which strongly suggests that it is not a Kentish name. I then revised the search but left the county open and got a large number of hits. What was significant was that the majority had a registration district volume of 5b or 5c - which are locations in Devon - a coastal county which generated a lot of seafarers. Indeed, this birth may be relevant:
Births Jun 1867 TREMLETT Agnes Maud O Bridgwater, vol. 5c, p.437

She marries in 1891 in Wirral, Cheshire - also a long way from Devon.

It seems that your Agnes was probably a domestic servant - cook - to a household in Birchington, got "in the family way' and was sent packing, ending up in the workhouse to have her baby. Is there any chance of identifying who she might have worked for?
Good hunting! Sylvia
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby laughing granny » Mon Jul 12, 2010 8:41 am

Hi! Sylvia

We did wonder if a member of the landed gentry had had his wicked way with Agnes but finding who she worked for is a problem.

Quex was a possibility and have been to the museum there. The archivist was on leave and a promise for her to contact us was made. A month or so later I sent an e mail requesting information again no contact from the archivist so drew a blank there as I live nearly three hundred miles away.

Like you I found the entry for Agnes Octavia and have the certificate which didn't lead me anywhere either but I'll have another look at that angle.

The seafaring connection is a good point and possibly why we can't find Edgar in 1901.

There may also be a clue in her sons' name as it was rather a 'posh' name to give an illigitimate child born in a workhouse
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby callbrian » Mon Jul 12, 2010 2:22 pm

Hi,
just to add to Sylvia's post.
It could well be your Agnes if she was the one born in Bridgewater and married in Cheshire.
She married either a Thomas Dean or Walter Rose, June qtr 1891 Wirral Vol 8a Page 678.
I did look for a Agnes Dean or Rose in the 1901 census with no luck.
Brian
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby meekhcs » Mon Jul 12, 2010 2:54 pm

Hello
Think I have found Edgar in the 1901 census. Still with George and Matilda, but the surname is listed as Dennett. George is a market gardener and dealer and Edgar is listed as a market gardeners assistant.The address is Orchard Cottage, Acol, Thanet. Acol is a village south of the Quex Estate. Nothing for his mother. Hope this fills in another peice of the picture. Sally
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby meekhcs » Mon Jul 12, 2010 3:37 pm

hi
further to my last post it looks as though "sommalian Cotts" has been added to the original census record at a later date which may explain the building date. George and Matildas name is Dennett not Kennett looking at the original census record so he obviously stayed with them through childhood.
cheers Sally
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby laughing granny » Mon Jul 12, 2010 10:45 pm

Hi! Folks

Thank you so much for your help.

The 1901 entry under the name of Dennett I agree is Agnes's son. This is the only time he is found with a surname other than Tremlett so perhaps he was fostered by George and Matilda as he certainly wasn't their son.

Unfortunately that doesn't solve the mystery of Agnes.

Agnes Maud Octavia Tremlett married Walter Rose (signal man) in Ellesmere Port April 19th 1891 but I've not found anything to link Edgar and this Agnes

This 1911 entry is interesting:
8 Military Road, Canterbury, Kent
Ingram Richard-head-widower-56-brushmaker-Southampton
Rose Agnes-housekeeper-married-45-Bridgewater, Hants
Rose Winnifred-daughter-single-17-domestic general-Somerset Cassy, kent
Rose Lucy-daughter-14-Canterbury, Kent
Rose Gladys-daughter-10-Canterbury-Kent
Rose Francis-daughter-6-Canterbury, Kent
Rose Daisy-daughter-4-Canterbury, Kent
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby Sylcec » Tue Jul 13, 2010 1:20 pm

Your 1911 census find certainly is interesting.

I note you said:
I've not found anything to link Edgar and this Agnes
.
As it does look as if Edgar was fostered to the Dennetts long-term, I somehow suspect that you are unlikely to find any further direct evidence linking him to his mother.

In the end you may need to work on possible candidates to be his mother and work to exclude them - the last Agnes standing will, on the balance of probabilities, most likely be Edgar's mother.

Incidentally, although the references to 'Quex estate' are a total mystery to me (local knowledge is probably needed for this), I do wonder if the Dennett's could have had a link to the household where Agnes worked when she became pregnant. I suspect that at the time Edgar was born arrangements for his care would not have been made 'at arm's length' but through friends, or at least family of friends.
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby ksouthall » Wed Jul 14, 2010 2:25 am

If Agnes worked on a large estate, there could be any number of potential fathers for Edgar; for example, members of the family Agnes was working for; members of staff - either inside the house or in the stables, or even any agricultural workers on the estate, to suggest but a few.

It would be interesting to find out if Edgar received any financial support towards his upbringing as, if he did, this might provide a clue to his parentage. It may be able to trace Edgar through school records if you know which schools he attended. Perhaps records still exist giving details of who paid any school fees?
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Re: AGNES TREMLETT

Postby debsstock » Thu Jul 15, 2010 8:16 am

Hi there
I've been doing a little bit of digging and have a couple of ideas for you.

First, with regard to Edgar's father, it struck me that his middle names were quite unusual, and might be the name of his father - it wasn't uncommon for a mother to include the name of the father in their illegitimate child's name.

I had a look for an Owen Warren in the 1891 census, being the nearest to Edgar's birth, and found a man of this name living at 2 Westgate Green, Canterbury. He was 26, married to Isabel with an 11 month old daughter Mabel, had been born in Margate, and was a Fruit Dealer. Also in the household was a boarder, Frank Stent, a single 23-year-old green grocer. Checking FreeBMD I found his marriage in the December quarter of 1888 in Thanet district - his name was given as Owen Albert Warren and his bride was Isabella Caroline Adams. In the 1881 census 17-year-old Owen was living with his uncle William Pettet in Ramsgate, although he was working as a bricklayer's labourer at that time.

If Owen Warren began working as a fruit dealer around the Isle of Thanet before his marriage it seems quite possible that he would have supplied shops in the Birchington area, which is only about 5 miles from Ramsgate and 2 from Margate. Perhaps he even supplied George Dennett's store - I note that George was a general dealer in Birchington 1891, and even worked part-time as a market gardener in Acol in 1901. Owen's marriage date means that he was single at the time of Edgar's conception/birth, and it does seem feasible that he could have come into contact with Agnes in her capacity as a cook, buying supplies. It may be worth having a look at the parish register for Birchington to see if Edgar was baptised, and if the father was named at the time. If he isn't I'm not sure how you could go about proving such a connection for definite, but I thought it worth flagging up as a possibility.

Incidentally, I haven't been able to find Owen, his wife or daughter in the 1901 census, although I note that the death of an Owen A. Warren, aged 85, was registered in Maidstone district in the March quarter of 1949 (ref 5b, 783).

Next, I did wonder whether George and Matilda Dennett were relatives of Agnes. I tracked them back through the 1881 and 1871 censuses - in Birchington and Hernhill respectively - and found their marriage registration in Dec quarter 1870 in Faversham, where Matilda's maiden name was given as Baker, but could make no obvious connection to the Tremlett family. Interestingly though, it appears that they had no children of their own (at least none appear in any census), but in 1881 their household included a 5 month old boarder, Alice Bear, who was born in Minster, Thanet, so perhpas they were in the habit of fostering workhouse babies. The workhouse registers might reveal more about this.

I have some more thoughts regarding the possible origins of Agnes, but I'll post these separately later.

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