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Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

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Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby Wendy0 » Fri Feb 28, 2020 12:24 am

Looking for birth of Richard Smith died SWAITHE MAIN. Barnsley, Yorkshire. 6th. December, 1875. 1871 Census place of birth quoted as 1843, Kingswinford, Staffordshire as is his 1864 marriage to Emma Litchfield. His marriage quotes his father as Thomas and in the inquest he is identified by his brother Thomas of Bacup. His brother Thomas said he was 29 at the time of the disaster making his birth 1846 and his 1864 marriage he is 22 giving a birth of 1842. Any help much appreciated. Wendy
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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby MoVidger » Fri Feb 28, 2020 4:57 am

In 1851,there is a Richard Smith (age 12) living with parents Thomas and Mary in Wombourne, Staffs. His birthplace is Kingswinford. Residing with this family are sister Ann (age 5), and a John Kirkham (age 20) and Mary Kirkham (age 19) - described as "wife's son and daughter". There's also a Sarah Kirkham (age 82).

In 1841, the family are living on Town End in Kingswinford.

There's a GRO birth for a Richard Smith in 1839. MMN: Kirtcham
Registration district: Stourbridge Union (which includes the parish of Kingswinford)

Possible marriage for Thomas Smith and Mary Kirkham: July 1837 in Dudley. She's listed as "spinster" and he's a "widower".
Last edited by MoVidger on Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby MoVidger » Fri Feb 28, 2020 5:17 am

John Kirkham was baptised in 1832 in Kingswinford. Mother's name: Mary. Father's name is blank. There's an 1852 burial for a John Kirkham (age 20) in Wombourne. Abode is Swindon.

Possible baptism for mother Mary Kirkham: 1809 in Kingswinford. Parents: John and Sarah.
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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby ciderdrinker » Fri Feb 28, 2020 11:48 am

Good morning
Just to add to the Smith side.
This could be Thomas marrying his first wife at Wombourne st Benedict
Thomas Smith bach and Ann Mollineux spinster 27.7.1828
wit M.A.Bratt and James Jinks?

Fathers on second marriage William Smith and John Kirkham

Himley baptism for Thomas Smith
Thomas s of William and Ann Smith 22.11.1807
Siblings Barnett (son) 11.10.1801 22.10.1857,Sarah 20.12.1802,Joseph and Mary 4.8.1805 (Joseph buried 30.11.1873),Eleanor 23.4.1809,John 30.6.1811-23.5.1813,William 1.11.1812,Sydney 1.9.1816 (living next to Thomas 1851) labourer ,Richard 3.12.1820 -7.5.1882 labourer and ,Lydia (buried 21.2.1819)and Martha 7.9.1817 labourer.

Possible burial for Thomas Smith age 71 years Seisden Workhouse 31/3/1879 at Himley.
records here for Workhouse
www.staffsnameindexes.org.uk/default.as ... ageIndex=5

William smith buried Himley 1780 -23.6.1854 of Himley
Ann Smith buried 1779-23..2.1841 Himley
Looks like William married Ann Snead at Wolverhampton St Peters 12.4.1801,bach and spinst
wit Richard Smith and Thomas Briggs .

The 1851 census Himley common
William Smith 70 widower nailer Kingswinford
Joseph son 45 farm lab Himley
Rosanna Shelly granddaughter 25 servant Pattingham
Helen Smith sister in law widow former laundress Womborne
John smith nephew 18 unmarried Himley

1841 Commonside
Abigail smith 87 y
William 60 nailor y
Joseph 36 nailor y

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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby Wendy0 » Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:12 pm

That looks interesting but where are Richard and Thomas Smith? Regards Wendy
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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby MoVidger » Fri Feb 28, 2020 2:19 pm

Thomas Smith (Richard's brother "of Bacup") was probably born after 1851. Given this Smith family was moving around a bit at the time, Kingswinford might not be his birthplace.

Richard wouldn't appear in Ciderdrinker's findings because that info relates to his father Thomas'
family.

Question: on Richard's 1864 marriage record, what is his father Thomas' occupation? Is he deceased at that point? Is he a labourer, like the chap in the census records above?

Ciderdrinker - great finds! I was having my usual insomnia last night, so didn't carry on with more research. As usual with me, I began having doubts if I had the "right" family. :?
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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby Wendy0 » Sat Feb 29, 2020 1:46 pm

The 1864 marriage certificate doesn't indicate that Richard's father Thomas Smith was deceased. I can't make out the occupation, it looks like mason, the middle letter could be s t l? Richard was a puddler at time of marriage and pit sinker at death. If Thomas was born after 1851 (Mary is getting a bit old), that would make him 16 at best, would a 13-16 year old be making the journey from Bacup? Unusual for Thomas not to be the first born son unless the first Thomas died therefore looking for 2 Thomas births. Thanks for helping.
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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby MoVidger » Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:08 pm

I've found Richard Smith (age 25) and Emma Litchfield (age 16) in the 1861 census. They were both residing in Brightside Bierlow, is separate households. Perhaps that's where they met?

Emma is transcribed as "Emma Setchfield" on Ancestry. She's a "servant" working for the James & Martha Drabble family. Her birthplace: Jump, Yorkshire.

Interestingly, Richard's birth year in this census is 1836. Birthplace is "Swinn, Staffordshire". Occupation: Iron Puddler. He's lodging with John & Harriet Sane.

Perhaps you need to cast your net wider with Richard's baptism search, given the 1836 birth year. Although it fits rather nicely with the Smith family I found earlier (see my original reply above).

1841- living on Town End, Kingswinford.
1851 - living in Swindon, Wombourne.
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Re: Brickwall - Richard Smith of Kingswinford, Staffordshire

Postby ciderdrinker » Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:00 pm

Hello
In the family Mo Viger found
Richard Smith born c 1837/8 Kingswinford son of Thomas and Mary would be your Richard Smith.
The 1841 census is at Commonside
Thomas 30 lab y
Mary 30 y
Richard 3 y
John Kirkham 11
Mary Kirkham 10

But that's not the one I was looking at so I saw a Thomas Smith with a wife Anna and children John ,Thomas,Ann and nk 11 weeks and thought it was the same family .
That's where I went wrong.
Going through the GRO index for smith /Kirkham births the only one I can see is Richard.

The 1837 marriage describes Thomas senior as a widower ,so did he have a family before ,with his first wife ? It would make sense to call his oldest son Thomas after himself.

It's not impossible Mary had more children after 1851 but as you say unlikely.
Mary Kirkham was baptised 22.10.1809 at Kingswinford d of John and Sarah Kirkham.
So brother Thomas could be born 1822-1837.From the first wife.
But with a name like Smith there are just tons of baptisms out there.

Father Thomas Smith is on the 1871 census as a lodger ,alone but still married.In 1861 he was with a John Smith age 52 as a lodger at Wombourne but then described as a widower.
If I'm right he died 1879 and was buried at Himley.

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