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Same woman?

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Same woman?

Postby Amazinggrace » Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:31 pm

Hi,
While looking for the death of my great grandfather I have come across an anomaly.
Thomas Gavin was born in 1851 and according to all the census just says Ireland.
He married my great grandmother Mary Callan on the 3rd Sept 1875 in Lesmahagow.
There is a death on Scotlands people for a Thomas Gavin on the 7th March 1926 in
Midcalder,West Lothian aged 75.Everything up to now is correct until we look at the
details of his wife on the death certificate.According to that his deceased wife and mother are one and the same.Where do I go from here?
Grace. :?
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Re: Same woman?

Postby Amazinggrace » Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:33 pm

sorry should have said they are saying Helen McClusky in both cases.
Thanks
Grace :roll:
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Re: Same woman?

Postby AdrianB38 » Sun Dec 01, 2019 6:23 pm

My comment (or sometimes it's an excuse) is usually that the person best placed to fill in the details on the death certificate - err, isn't around to do so. If I understand you correctly, by that time, his wife is deceased - so does that mean it's a child of Thomas G who gave the details for the DC?

Now, I can understand that this person might not know the name of the mother of Thomas G - after all, would I know that my own GPs had names other than Granny and Granddad if I hadn't taken this hobby up? But not knowing the wife of Thomas G - who is presumably their own mother sounds a bit odd. (Again, note that I am assuming that it's a child of Thomas G who gave the details for the DC. If not that close, then anything can happen)

So if we do assume that they aren't both Helen McClusky in real life, then there is an error - but which?

Firstly, are you 100% certain that you have the right Thomas G? (Sorry but I have to ask)

Is it possible that your Thomas G married again to a Helen McClusky that you've not heard of? Stranger things have happened - you ought to be able to check ScotlandsPeople for that.

If it really, really is your Thomas G and he didn't marry again, then that would suggest that the wife on the DC is wrong and that therefore Helen McClusky is Thomas' mother. Unless both are wrong. :cry:

I suspect that a lot depends on who the informant was for that DC - and did they understand the questions, were the answers written down correctly....
Adrian
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Re: Same woman?

Postby junkers » Sun Dec 01, 2019 6:38 pm

The death certificate must be wrong, if you go by what is on Thomas's marriage certificate where it says his mother's maiden name was Blackburn. I can only assume that the clerk who copied the entry got it wrong. There should be a local copy of the marriage which may confirm this. I am surprised that no-one else has noticed the contradiction.
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Re: Same woman?

Postby Amazinggrace » Sun Dec 01, 2019 7:39 pm

Thanks Adrian andJunkers.
Yes according to the marriage certificate his mother was Helen Blackburn.
His wife was Mary Callan.
I am a member of West Lothian Family History Society,so may contact them and see what records they can bring up.
Thanks again
Grace :D
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Re: Same woman?

Postby MayHam » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:05 pm

Just to confuse things, ScotlandsPeople has an 1852 Catholic marriage in Paisley between Peter Gavan & Helen Turnbull. I mentioned earlier, that Thomas' marriage certificate may list his name as Thomas H. Turnbull which was also the minister's name.

Helen died in 1881 in Paisley and may have been older than her husband. I couldn't find a marriage between Turnbull & Blackburn/McClusky. According to most censuses, Peter was born in Ireland. Unfortunately, I couldn't find any children. So, maybe the wrong family?
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Re: Same woman?

Postby MayHam » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:11 pm

Also, noticed Thomas' son, Robert, lists Thomas' parents as Robert & Helen on Thomas' 1926 death certificate. Perhaps, he was confusing them with his mother's parents, Robert & Helen (Carruthers) Callan?

BTW, FamilySearch lists Robert's baptism in 1897 in Mid Calder, Midlothian, parents: Thomas Gavin & Mary Callan.
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Re: Same woman?

Postby Amazinggrace » Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:28 pm

Thanks Mayhem,
This genealogy hobby certainly gives you a headache.
Mind you when you solve it ,it all seems worthwhile.
Thanks everyone,
grace :D
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