Moderator Control Panel ]

Where were they in 1891?

A problem shared is a problem halved. Post your brick walls here and see whether you can offer advice to others

Where were they in 1891?

Postby SDV » Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:56 pm

Rosina Connelly DANIELS (1868-1954) married Thomas William MORRIS (1871-1944) -n July 1899 in Islington. At the time, both gave their address as Grafton Road, Kentish Town. Thomas was a railway labourer.

In 1881, Rosina (13) was living at 4 The Grove, Hornsey with her father George Thomas DANIELS and her step-mother Mary Ann DANIELS. Thomas (9) was living with his parents, George and Louisa, at Lichee Street, St Pancras.

By 1901, the couple were living at 18 Priory Street, St Pancras, with Thomas working as a coal porter.

There is some big gaps in the above, in particular, their whereabouts in 1891. I'm guessing that they were both somewhere in the Islington - Camden - St Pancras area. If there is anybody with better search skills than me, I would be grateful.
SDV
 
Posts: 443
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:47 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby GillJones » Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:05 pm

This is an 1891 Census page from St.John the Evangelist, Westminster, District Salvation Army Shelter. It shows Morris, Thomas - 17 - Coal Porter. The stated age is not exactly right, but they are often wrong on the census! He had also been transcribed on Ancestry as Morris Thomas! Could this be your Thomas Morris? I've not been able to find Rosina Daniels yet.
Morris%2C%20Thomas.jpeg
Morris%2C%20Thomas.jpeg (159.85 KiB) Viewed 909 times


Sent from my Lenovo YB1-X90F using Who Do You Think You Are? Magazine Forum mobile app
GillJones
 
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:51 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby SDV » Wed Oct 09, 2019 3:14 pm

Gill - you could well be right. I agree that whilst not spot on, the age is not impossible being only 2 years out. The name again is not spot on, but not impossible. The trouble is I have no idea how to positively prove that it is him.
SDV
 
Posts: 443
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:47 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby phsvm » Thu Oct 10, 2019 12:10 pm

SDV wrote:The trouble is I have no idea how to positively prove that it is him


Not positive but it might help. Can you find any other references to this 1891 Thomas Morris? If not that must surely increase the likelihood that this is one in the same.
phsvm
 
Posts: 716
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2010 8:14 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby MoVidger » Sat Oct 12, 2019 6:41 pm

Is Alice Daniels, the younger sister of Rosina, the "actress/dancer" mentioned in Oct 1899 newspaper reports? She appears in Islington workhouse records in 1899, described as "dancer" (age 30). She was released to Police. Apparently she attempted suicide by drinking poison. At the the time, she was living at Fairmead Road, Upper Holloway.

"Evidence was that she and her child were living with a man in no way related. There had been disputes over money matters". A warrant was subsequently obtained and she was arrested at the workhouse infirmary. She was charged on remand at North London Police Court.

The Islington Gazette (16 October 1899) has the most information, particularly with the domestic situation and the fate of the daughter.

Looks like Alice is in the 1901 census in Kentish Town. Listed as "boarder", age 30, birthplace Islington. I only mention it, in case it provides clues as to Rosina's whereabouts in 1891.

Do you have a copy of Rosina's 1899 marriage certificate? I'm curious as to her occupation (if any) considering she would have been age 30/31 at the time.
MoVidger
 
Posts: 783
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:14 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby MoVidger » Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:24 pm

Speaking of newspaper reports, there is an 1885 mention for a Rosina Daniels (age 15) and another teenage girl. They were charged with stealing clothes from a shop at 107 Fonthill Road. Rosina was residing with her "partners in crime" at 123 Campbell Road, Holloway. Both girls were imprisoned for 14 days. The woman they lived with (Amelia Cook) was sentenced to 3 months hard labour for receiving the stolen property.

See Reynolds's Newspaper 18 January 1885 for more details. Trivia: my Mum worked for Reynolds News (although not in 1885)! :lol:
MoVidger
 
Posts: 783
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:14 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby MoVidger » Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:36 pm

SDV - I've connected the Rosina Daniels from the 1885 theft above to your Rosina! FMP has several criminal records with images for Rosina/Rose Daniels from 1888 to 1892, during which she was in and out of prison.

An 1889 record includes a column for Distinctive Marks. Rosina has an "indistinct tattoo (supposed to be Tom Morris) on left forearm". That certainly links Rosina to her future husband.

And wait for it - in 1892 she was charged with maliciously wounding...Thomas Morris.

Given that Rosina obviously knew Tom Morris by 1889, does that make her one of two "Rosina Morris" found in the 1891 census? Both are servants. Rosina Morris (born 1873 Islington) residing in Highgate Hornsey. The other Rosina Morris (born 1871 St Pancras) residing Bethnal Green. That theory makes sense, as Rosina Daniels also has convictions for larceny from various employers while a servant.
MoVidger
 
Posts: 783
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:14 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby Templ4r » Sun Oct 13, 2019 10:22 am

Here you are Mo.. A good find, well done.
Attachments
rose daniels.jpg
rose daniels.jpg (64.8 KiB) Viewed 512 times
Templ4r
 
Posts: 112
Joined: Sun Aug 18, 2019 8:14 am

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby SDV » Sun Oct 13, 2019 10:55 am

Mo - in response to your first post, as I haven't yet digested your last two. I have no idea if the Alice mentioned in the Islington Gazetter was Rosina's sister.

Both Rosina (b Jan 1868) and Alice (b Sep 1869) were from my GGF's first marriage to Katharine CONNELLY. Katharine was born b 1849 in Bristol, though no birth certificate or baptism has ever been found. She died very young in Jan 1872 of enteric fever. My GGF subsequently remarried - though no marriage certificate has ever been found - to Mary Ann TAPLIN (1854-1931), with whom he had 12 or possibly 13 children!

The 1871 census finds both Rosina and Alice living with their parents George Thomas and Catharine Daniels at Scholefield Road, Holloway. Catharine was a catholic and both girls were raised as catholics, whereas later children were raised formally in the Anglican faith but in reality in no faith.

By 1881, George Thomas had paired up with Mary Ann. Rosina and Alice were living with their father, their step-mother and four half siblings at The Grove, Hornsey. The family as newspaper reports testify were in and out of trouble with the police, with lots of drink related incidents!

In 1891, I have yet to locate Rosina though by now she was married to Thomas Morris - no occupation on her marriage certificate. Alice, however, was living with her Grandparents, Charles and Eliza Daniels, at Cromwell Road, Islington. She is a general servant.

In 1901, Rosina is living with her husband and two children in Priory Street, St Pancras. I have records for her for both 1911 and 1939. She died in 1954 at St John's Way, Holborn.

Alice, I believe is a boarder living at Retcar Street, St Pancras and working as a charwoman. I have no record for her for 1911. I know, however, that she married Philip James Cannell, a widower, in January 1918, when she would have been 40, at Camden. In 1939, she was living as a widow at Warrender Road, Islington, where she died in Jan 1953.

I am now going to track down the info from your last two posts.

Many thanks for your work and skills.
SDV
 
Posts: 443
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:47 pm

Re: Where were they in 1891?

Postby SDV » Sun Oct 13, 2019 11:49 am

God - my family. It's only a few months ago we were all being entertained by the antics of Rosina's step-mother, who preferred a poker to a knife!

I am still wondering where Alice was in 1911.
SDV
 
Posts: 443
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:47 pm

Next

Return to General research queries


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests