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Esther White

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Esther White

Postby EwanL1 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:35 am

I have posted a question on Esther White before as, aside from her father’s name (Joseph) from her marriage certificate, I have drawn a complete blank and hoped that someone here would have a spark of inspiration. The family story is that she was from Leeds (with some saying Bradford) and there is some discrepancy over her date of birth, though her grave and 1939 Register entry list it as 31st December 1891, but her death certificate says that date in 1889.

The story goes that she was in service to a doctor and his family, before falling pregnant by someone unknown and then moving to Birmingham when her own family cut her off. The date of her marriage to Benjamin Lewis on 18th October 1914, with her listed as living at the same address as him, and the fact that the baby, Lily May, was born around that time suggested to me that the father was Benjamin. It is also notable that the story is that her family cut her off but her father is listed on her marriage certificate, and his employment as a foundry man.

I’ve looked for birth certificates on the GRO site for an Esther White around the date of birth but none match her information. Thanks in advance for any help!
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Re: Esther White

Postby woodchal » Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:03 pm

One of the witnesses on the wedding between Esther White and Benjamin Lewis is a Bert Rose.

On the GRO Index there is the birth of Esther White with the mother's maiden surname is also Rose. - GRO Reference: 1890 S Quarter in PANCRAS Volume 01B Page 76

It might be worth examining the possibility that this is more than a coincidence, by getting the birth certificate.
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Re: Esther White

Postby woodchal » Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:13 pm

...however this might be the Esther White who died in 1893 at the age of three

WHITE, ESTHER 3
GRO Reference: 1893 S Quarter in LONDON CITY Volume 01C Page 12
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Re: Esther White

Postby EwanL1 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 1:57 pm

woodchal wrote:...however this might be the Esther White who died in 1893 at the age of three

WHITE, ESTHER 3
GRO Reference: 1893 S Quarter in LONDON CITY Volume 01C Page 12

Ah ok, I’ll have a look into it when I get home. Thank you!
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Re: Esther White

Postby carobradford » Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:25 pm

Her family "cutting her off" would not be a reason for her father's information to be omitted from the marriage certificate. That information is a requirement - unless it is unknown - not a gesture of familial sentiment.

Nor, alas, is it significant that both parties gave the same address when they married. This was so common it was practically the norm and indicates only that one or both parties were actually resident in a different parish and used an address of convenience (often the home of one of them) to avoid paying for two or more sets of banns to be read. It certainly is not evidence of cohabitation.

Not a helpful response, I know, but best not to clutch at misleading straws!
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Esther White

Postby brunes08 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 2:29 pm

Just a couple of things that I noted from the information you provided. Whether or not Esther was estranged from her parents is irrelevant regarding her marriage certificate. Fathers do not have to attend a marriage in order to be recorded on the certificate. The information is a basic statement of fact. Secondly, who reported her death to the Registrar? This person may not have known Esther’s exact age and said what he/she thought. When the information given to the Registrar is completed, there is no follow-up checks on the accuracy. The information is accepted in good faith. Hope that helps a little.


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Re: Esther White

Postby EwanL1 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:17 pm

carobradford wrote:Her family "cutting her off" would not be a reason for her father's information to be omitted from the marriage certificate. That information is a requirement - unless it is unknown - not a gesture of familial sentiment.

Nor, alas, is it significant that both parties gave the same address when they married. This was so common it was practically the norm and indicates only that one or both parties were actually resident in a different parish and used an address of convenience (often the home of one of them) to avoid paying for two or more sets of banns to be read. It certainly is not evidence of cohabitation.

Not a helpful response, I know, but best not to clutch at misleading straws!

Thank you! I thought as much, just grasping at anything now.
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Re: Esther White

Postby EwanL1 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 7:18 pm

brunes08 wrote:Just a couple of things that I noted from the information you provided. Whether or not Esther was estranged from her parents is irrelevant regarding her marriage certificate. Fathers do not have to attend a marriage in order to be recorded on the certificate. The information is a basic statement of fact. Secondly, who reported her death to the Registrar? This person may not have known Esther’s exact age and said what he/she thought. When the information given to the Registrar is completed, there is no follow-up checks on the accuracy. The information is accepted in good faith. Hope that helps a little.


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Her son, Albert, reported it but I working on the date from the grave/1939 Register. Thank you for your help!
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Re: Esther White

Postby ianbee » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:11 pm

And where did Albert say that Esther was born? Did he say Leeds or Bradford?
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Re: Esther White

Postby EwanL1 » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:52 pm

ianbee wrote:And where did Albert say that Esther was born? Did he say Leeds or Bradford?

Leeds, they had two other daughters as well as Albert, Winifred (born 1918) and Vera (I’m finding out her birthdate tomorrow when I speak to that side of the family) both of whom died a few years ago. The Bradford part comes from Vera’s children.
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