Moderator Control Panel ]

Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

A problem shared is a problem halved. Post your brick walls here and see whether you can offer advice to others

Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby MoVidger » Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:28 pm

Having decided to revisit my maternal 3 x great-grandparents, I'm still faced with the mystery of two "daughters" who've had me stumped for a decade.

Parents: John Worrel (c1786 Glasgow?-1861 Dundee) and Elspeth Tait (1797 Errol-1864 Dundee)
They had 8 children born 1815 to 1829 in Errol, followed by 2 children born 1833 to 1838 in Dundee.
I have accounted for all 10 children with their baptisms, various marriages and/or childhood deaths.

The mystery are two girls who are living with the Worral/Worrel family in the 1841 and 1851 census records in Dundee.

1841 census (Session Street, Dundee) - Isbella Worrel, born c1836 in Dundee.
1851 census (Dudhope Crescent, Dundee) - Isabella Worral, born c1837 in Dundee (scholar).
1851 census (Dudhope Crescent, Dundee) - Bety Worral, born c1832 in Errol (power loom winder).

Unlike the other 10 children, there are no baptism records for these two girls, yet they are each described as "daughter" in the 1851 census.

In Oct 1851, there is a Betsey Worril who marries a David Nairn (joiner) in Dundee. Betsey is described as "dau of Jno Worril". So she is a likely candidate. (It appears this Nairn couple moved to Northumberland).

However, Isabella disappears after the 1851 census. There is an Isabella Worrell (b 1837) working in Lambeth in the 1881 census, but she is described as "widow".

I've searched Scotland's People and Family Search for a baptism for Isabella and whereabouts after 1851, but no luck. I'd be very grateful if anyone else can lend a fresh pair of eyes. :D
MoVidger
 
Posts: 760
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:14 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby sdup26 » Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:36 pm

Familysearch lists children of John Worrel and Elspeth Tait in Errol, and also children of John Worrel and Margaret Tait. Did John marry twice or were there two John Worrels?
Betsy Worrel is listed in the household of William Abbot (Session Street) in the 1841 census, when no relationships are stated, but do you know of a family connection, or was she just visiting? In 1851, John and Elspeth have a grand-daughter Helen. Is she Betsy's daughter?
sdup26
 
Posts: 1502
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 4:34 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby MoVidger » Mon Jun 17, 2019 8:21 pm

Hi sdup26 - Sorry, I should have mentioned that several records incorrectly list Elspeth's name as "Margaret". It confused me early on, too. I know of no Worrell connection to the Abbot family, so perhaps Betsy was visiting their household on 1841 census night?

"Helen", the granddaughter you see in the 1851 census, is actually elder son Robert Worrel's daughter Ellen (born 1847 in Scarborough). Her mother Priscilla Worrel (nee Purvis) can be found living at Dudhope Crescent (with older daughter Priscilla, born 1848 in York) in 1851.

Robert Worrel/Whirrel was born 23 Feb 1815 in Errol. No idea where he is in 1841 and 1851 census. He just disappears. In 1846, he married Priscilla Purvis in Scarborough. They obviously moved to Dundee by 1851, as third daughter Elizabeth (Betsey) is 6 days old in the 1851 census. But no sign of Robert.

By the 1861 census, Priscilla is a "widow" and living in Glasgow with four daughters. I have accounted for all of them, except for youngest daughter Mary, born in Glasgow in 1853.

But it's Isabella Worrell I'd like to find after 1851. Very odd that there are no baptism records for Isabella or sister Betsy. Robert's whereabouts may never be solved. He may have been a plasterer, the family trade.
MoVidger
 
Posts: 760
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:14 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby sdup26 » Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:58 pm

It's strange that Isabella and Betsy don't seem to have been baptised; any chance the family had changed their religious allegiance by the time the two girls were born?
I can see why you ruled out the Isabella Worrell living in Lambeth in 1881; she's listed as a 'widow' which in theory, means Worrell was her married name. Unless it was Isabella, and she claimed to be a widow for 'respectability,' as some employers preferred to employ a widow, rather than a single woman.
And just to complete my list of dismal failures, I can't find Robert Worrell! But as someone once said, tomorrow is another day!
sdup26
 
Posts: 1502
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 4:34 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby AdrianB38 » Wed Jun 19, 2019 9:50 am

Re the missing baptisms - if I understand correctly, they ought to have been in Scotland - Dundee? The issue with Scots baptisms is that there were so many denominations that the chance of any particular baptism being in the Established Church of Scotland is quite a bit less than the chance of any baptism being in the Church of England, south of the Border.

ScotlandsPeople covers the Church of Scotland, plus Roman Catholic and *some* of the other breakaway Presbyterian churches. There are still plenty of registers not online. For instance, in the Dundee area, I know from searching for details of my 4G GF (and failing) that the books for something called the Glassite church are at Dundee University (but don't quote me!) and aren't online. The Friends of Dundee City Archives did a book called The Kirks of Dundee Presbytery which lists the various Presbyterian (only) churches in the area. I have used this book to identify what the possible churches were and then identify what Dundee City Archives held. But I don't have any feeling for coverage in the era that you're looking at.

There are still other churches such as the Episcopal and Congregational which I don't have much idea about regarding their baptisms - if they had them!

All of which is a lengthy way of saying that, if you can't find baptisms in Scotland, well, I'm not surprised.

Sent from my Moto G6 Play using Who Do You Think You Are? Magazine Forum mobile app
Adrian
AdrianB38
 
Posts: 2617
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2010 4:07 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby patmblack » Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:36 am

I'm assuming you have discounted that Isabella & Betesy are not pet names for their other daughters.
patmblack
 
Posts: 15
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 5:14 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby MoVidger » Fri Jun 21, 2019 4:19 pm

All of the Worrel children with baptisms have been accounted for. I considered pet names, as well. Or possibly girls who the Worrel family had “adopted” (e.g. grandchildren or nieces).

Betsy married in Oct 1851, and is therefore accounted for now (except for her baptism, which as Adrian points out, may not exist). I have considered that Isabella may be a relation being raised as “daughter”. In fact, she could be from the Tait family, but I need to research this theory.

On a side note, I discovered yesterday that father John Worrel is listed under “Taverns and Public Houses” for Errol (with father-in-law Robert Tait) in the Scotland, Post Office Directories 1825/26 set on FMP. John is listed as “Worrel, John (& plasterer)”.

This supports Robert Tait’s 1851 census occupation of “Brewer, in receipt of Parish Relief”.

In the Dundee Post Office Directories for 1842/43, John's listed as “Worrel, John, vintner, 5 Session Street”. This supports his 1841 census occupation of “spirit merchant ??”. Although I had wrongly presumed it was connected to his regular trade of plastering (e.g. something akin to spirit level!) :lol:
MoVidger
 
Posts: 760
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:14 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby MayHam » Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:51 am

The Friends of Dundee Council Archives has a lovely site (that is copywrited).
https://www.fdca.org.uk/index.html

1. Click on the above link and scroll down to "Quick Links."
2. Click on "Old Dundee Graveyards and Other Burial Records."
3. Click on "The Howff."
4. Click on "The Burials Index."
You will find your John and family's burial records, including Isabella Worrell [Batchelor].

You can find her death certificate on ScotlandsPeople witnessed by her husband, William Batchelor.
She married in 1858 under the name Elizabeth Worrel.
MayHam
 
Posts: 307
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 10:28 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby MayHam » Mon Jun 24, 2019 1:02 am

Also, in the Howff Graveyard records you will find three William Worrels.

One died of Asthma and may be the same William Wirrel who married Christian Hill in 1806 in Inveresk and Musselburgh. He was a private in the Forfarshire Militia at the time of his marriage. He may have joined the 91st in 1810 until being discharged in 1819 due to Asthma. He said he was born around 1786 in Dundee but I haven't been able to confirm this date.
https://www.findmypast.com/transcript?i ... O119/36471
MayHam
 
Posts: 307
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2016 10:28 pm

Re: Worrel family (Errol/Dundee)

Postby MoVidger » Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:33 am

MayHam - thank you so much for these great finds! Just the other day I had seen a death record for that William Wirrall, flax dresser, and wondered if he could be a relative of John's.
There has to be some close connection, as you advise that William's wife was named Christian Hill. That was the name of John and Elspeth's youngest child, who died after catching on fire from getting too near the fire inside the family home. :(

Interesting that Isabella's married name was Elizabeth. I will search for the records you mentioned.

And a big thank you for the heads-up regarding William's 1819 attestation record. I will study it in depth tomorrow. Something about the 91st Regiment is ringing bells with me, as well. Possibly a connection to the 24th, which was the regiment of John's father. If memory serves, I think the 24th and 91st were both in Canada during the late 18th-century.
MoVidger
 
Posts: 760
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:14 pm


Return to General research queries


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests