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It should be so straight forward and yet...

Thu Oct 25, 2018 11:37 pm

Dear All,

I am researching a family tree, I have loads of information but I can't pin down a solid record. I know that there are far cleverer people than me on this forum so I was wondering if one of those people would take a look over the information I have for me and give me some direction as to where I can go next.

So, I here are the facts.

I am researching Joan I Murray, I know she was born in 1915 in Birkenhead, the birth record states that her mothers maiden name was De Groot.

Joan I Murray is also on the 1939 census, she is living in Wirral, the census shows her living with (I presume her mum) Adelaide Jeanie French Murray, born 24/5/1886, and her sister Jeanie Adelaide Murray born 23/4/20 (I checked her birth record her mums maiden name was also called De Groot.)

This Census states Adelaide Jeanie French Murray was a widow.

The next record I have is a 1920 Liverpool voting record which shows AJF Murray living with a John Inglis Murray.

I have found John Inglis Murray on the 1911 census, at this point he is a boarder and single.

I have a death record showing John Inglis Murray died in 1923....so far it all fits together

However

His probate states the executor of the will was his father not AJF.

Nor can I find any marriage record between Murray and AJF, so did they ever get married?

Also I can find no record, (bar the 1920 voters register and the 1939 census,) of AJF De Groot/ Murray, so where are all the records?

Any help you can give me would be greatly appreciated?

Re: It should be so straight forward and yet...

Fri Oct 26, 2018 5:15 am

Welcome to the forum.

My first thought when I saw your post was the couple, Murray and De Groot, were not english, so you wouldn’t necessarily find their marriage in England. I may be completely wrong, as you can’t see where Adelaide Jeanie was born (surname sounds Dutch), and you don’t state where John Inglis Murray was born ( He sound Scottish). Try finding her in 1901 or 1911 census, this should tell you where she came from.

As for executor of the will, this may be because the will was written before his marriage, and it was never altered after his marriage, so nothing sinister about the fact his father was named executor.

He sounds a bit young to have written a will already, so was this because he joined the army? Try looking for a service record for him.

Some thoughts and suggestions for you

Re: It should be so straight forward and yet...

Fri Oct 26, 2018 7:51 am

They married in Milton (Glasgow) Scotland in 1912.

The index entry on ScotlandsPeople has other surnames for Adelaide (Craven and Haly) so it would appear she has been married (or changed her name) before. You would need to look at the register entry to see what the order of names were.

Re: It should be so straight forward and yet...

Fri Oct 26, 2018 9:29 am

Thank you both so much!

Yes, you are (both) right, she is foreign, well Scottish anyway! I can now see the record.

On a side note, it is a major floor in Ancestry that they don't have better Scottish records, the records on Scotlandspeople are great but I don't like the pay as you go aspect but you don't know how many records you may need, I would rather pay a monthly fee. Heh ho first world problems I suppose.

Thanks you both again, I really appreciate it

Re: It should be so straight forward and yet...

Fri Oct 26, 2018 10:39 am

Marriage from Scotlands People

DE GROOT
ADELAIDE JEANIE
MURRAY
JOHN INGLIS
1912
644/9 305
Milton

Death for the records

DE GROOT
ADELAIDE JEANIE
MURRAY
JOHN INGLIS
1912
644/9 305
Milton

Re: It should be so straight forward and yet...

Sat Oct 27, 2018 1:56 pm

Had to laugh at MikePhillips 50 comment.My english husband always refers to me as foreign. I am scottish!!
Grace :D

Re: It should be so straight forward and yet...

Wed Nov 07, 2018 11:28 pm

Thank you for all your help. People genuinely are so helpful on this site, I just wish I was slightly better at this malarkey and I could help people in return!
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