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Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

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Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby SDV » Fri Oct 12, 2018 6:00 pm

Rose Monenia PONTDING married Stephen HARDING at All Saints in Fulham in July 1888. She was 28 and a spinster. Her father was Montague PONTING, a gamekeeper.

1891 found the couple living in Wandsworth with the children of Stephen's first marriage and two young children of her own. Rose is 30 and her birth place is given as Pontypridd in Wales.

Stephen died in 1898 and later that same year she re-married to Herbert Edward BELLENGER. At the marriage in 1898 at Wandsworth RO, she is described as a widow aged 33. Her father is still Montague PONTING.

1901 and 1911 find the couple living in Wandsworth with their children. In 1901, Rose is 32 and her birth place is Pontypridd, Glamorgan. In 1911, she is 43 and born in Wales.

She died in 1917 in Wandsworth.

I can find no record of Rose or her father before her first marriage, despite their not common names. I would be grateful if anyone can discover some clues to their whereabouts prior to 1888.
SDV
 
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby Mick Loney » Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:03 pm

First thing I spotted, is that her age is inconsistent. She is 28 in 1888, in 1898 she is 33, and 1911 she is 43! ( are you looking at actual parish registers or transcriptions)

If she is ‘adjusting’ her age to this extent, what else is she adjusting? When was her last child born? Childbearing normally ceases around 40-45 of age, so this may give you a better approximation for her year of birth!
Also, remember, if she was illegitimate, she may have made up her father’s name to make her more respectable!
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby elsabels » Fri Oct 12, 2018 10:39 pm

Information on census returns certificates is only as good as the informant either knows or believes they know!

Have you checked the death certificate for clues?
Name: Rose Bellenger
Death Age: 49
Birth Date: abt 1868
Registration Date: Mar 1917
Registration district: Wandsworth
Inferred County: Greater London
Volume: 1d
Page: 826
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby woodchal » Fri Oct 12, 2018 11:18 pm

2nd Marriage to Herbert is a Rose Harding with a father Ponting suggesting that it is the same Rose

In 1911 census she says there had been 14 children from marriage of which 7 have died. Here are 9 of them, all with mother’s maiden name ponting

BELLENGER, HERBERT EDWARD JAMES PONTING 1899 J Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 810
BELLENGER, ELLEN FLORENCE PONTING 1899 J Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 810
BELLENGER, ALFRED HERBERT EDWARD PONTING 1900 S Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 725
BELLENGER, CHARLES REGINALD PONTING 1902 J Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 711
BELLENGER, ALFRED FREDERICK PONTING 1904 J Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 676
BELLENGER, BEATRICE ELLA PONTING 1904 J Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 676
BELLENGER, ALICE MABEL PONTING 1905 S Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 665
BELLENGER, SARAH ELEANOR PONTING 1908 J Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 703
BELLENGER, GILBERT CHRISTOPHER CECIL PONTING 1910 M Quarter in WANDSWORTH Volume 01D Page 661
Last edited by woodchal on Sat Oct 13, 2018 9:30 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby woodchal » Fri Oct 12, 2018 11:27 pm

Outside chance From FreeReg

St Mary Parish Register Pen-allt, Monmouthshire has a baptism 17 Jul 1846 for a Edwin Montague Panting
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby SDV » Sat Oct 13, 2018 11:16 pm

Trouble is that he disappears after 1861, so difficult to connect to Rose.

I would have thought that Monenia was different enough to attract hits, but it seems that I am badly mistaken.

I have ordered the death certificate for Rose, but not yet received it.
SDV
 
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby elsabels » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:52 pm

If Montague Ponting was a gamekeeper it is likely that he would have been listed in a trade directory or the local press, cases of trespass, landlords advising who their gamekeeper etc is /was! in rural areas it was considered quite a post.

Searching Glamorganshire all years 1841 - 1911 with the word Gamekeeper produces 506 records, there is one PONTING William b 1838 Gloucestershire and no Montague's!
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby woodchal » Sun Oct 14, 2018 10:11 pm

It might be worth trying to work out what kind of name is Monenia (from her signature in could be Monemia). Is it a family surname used as a middle name or ... sorry I don't have any more ideas
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby elsabels » Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:50 am

Re visiting
Age on marriage certificate, this would probably need to be Over 21 otherwise parental agreement etc would be needed, this places her birth at <1868

Looking 'out of the box' I came across this child!

Name: Rose Mary Ponting
Registration Year: 1868
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Registration district: Wandsworth
Volume: 1d Page: 516

Rose Mary Ponting
Birth Date: 19 Jan 1868
Baptism Date: 15 Mar 1868
Baptism Place: Holy Trinity,Clapham,Surrey,England
Mother: Mary Catherine Ponting

1871 RG10; Piece: 695; Folio: 44; Page: 17
Charles Nicholls 64
Charlotte Nicholls 55
Frances Marie Greenfield 19
Rose Ponting 4
Maruice Plumridge 3
elsabels
 
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Re: Rose Monenia PONTING < 1888

Postby SDV » Mon Oct 15, 2018 10:52 pm

That's very interesting elsebels.

I have no idea at present whether this Rose is the one I am interested in, but it is certainly worth investigating as I seem to be getting nowhere following the Montague and Welsh angle.

Thanks for the suggestion.

As always, all help is appreciated.
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