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Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

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Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby DianaCanada » Sat Sep 15, 2018 11:40 pm

I am trying to sort out three male relatives, brothers who appear to have married three sisters (I know two are sisters, the third I have not been able to sort out). The men have the surname Hope and the brides were all McPhail. They lived in Hulme (later S. Manchester), Lancs., and by 1939 one had moved to Cheshire.
I think I have sorted out the 12 children that are listed with a Hope father and a McPhail mother. I finally found all three families on the 1939 Register. One was difficult as the writing was terrible but I tracked him down using his birth date.

I believe I have found Annie Hope blanked out on the 1939, she was b. Mar 1919 in Chorlton district.
Her parents are likely Ernest and Mary Ann (McPhail) Hope. She is listed as the first child, with three assumed younger siblings b. 1920, 1923, and 1927. The three younger ones are all named. I wonder why a young woman of 20 years in 1939 would be blanked out? Was this done for anyone who is still alive, as she could be? I thought it was only for those who were children at the time.

Anyone have any tips on tracing the third McPhail (Catherine b. 14 Apr 1894) whom I can't link to the other two (Eliza, wife of Peter, b. 1895 and Mary Ann, wife of Ernest b. ca 1897 both sisters born in Manchester.) Eliza and Mary Ann are with parents Nathaniel and Isabella in 1901 but no sign of Catherine (b. 14 Apr 1894) who married Harold Hope.
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby Mick Loney » Sun Sep 16, 2018 5:48 am

Diane,
All possible living people are blanked out (redacted). If their age is less than 100, they are assumed still alive, unless known otherwise. The register was a working document, and was constantly being updated when Deaths or Marriages occured (hence the married names you see entered for daughters).

As Annie Hope falls foul of the 100 year rule, she too would be redacted! If you can prove she is dead (have death certificate), I believe you can apply for her to be un-redacted.
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby DianaCanada » Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:02 pm

Thank you, that makes sense.
My mother died here in Canada but of course has not been redacted as I would have to send the paperwork. As she was born in 1923, think I will wait.
Annie Hope in my query was born in Mar 1919 so I expect it will be redacted in the new year. Also possible she emigrated too, perhaps a war bride as my mother was.
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby Mick Loney » Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:27 pm

Diane,
I think you misunderstood me, when someone is redacted, they are blacked out! So Annie Hope is currently redacted, and will be un-redacted in the near furture! :D
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby DianaCanada » Sun Sep 16, 2018 4:32 pm

Mick Loney wrote:Diane,
I think you misunderstood me, when someone is redacted, they are blacked out! So Annie Hope is currently redacted, and will be un-redacted in the near furture! :D


Lol, I certainly did...I knew what you meant but got the word muddled!

Thank you for your help.
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby coopernicola » Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:47 pm

You may be really lucky, as I was recently. My 82 year old mother, still very much alive, has just been unredacted (if that’s the word). Which is very useful as I had assumed she had already been evacuated, as my father had been, by the time the 1939 Register was taken.
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby elsabels » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:27 pm

I am unable to find a Catherine McPhail b 1894 in the UK.

Your options are to purchase the marriage certificate, which is either a Registry Office or non conformist marriage in Manchester

or

follow the Nathaniel Mcphail family who hailed from Ireland and see if she was a cousin!
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby ianbee » Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:15 pm

DianaCanada wrote:Anyone have any tips on tracing the third McPhail (Catherine b. 14 Apr 1894) whom I can't link to the other two (Eliza, wife of Peter, b. 1895 and Mary Ann, wife of Ernest b. ca 1897 both sisters born in Manchester.) Eliza and Mary Ann are with parents Nathaniel and Isabella in 1901 but no sign of Catherine (b. 14 Apr 1894) who married Harold Hope.

Dec 1889 Chorlton 8c 1153
Hunter, Isabella
McVeigh, Nathaniel
Lancashire BMD - Chorlton-on-Medlock Register Office or Registrar Attended

The two daughters?
MCVEY, ELIZA ANN
Mother's Maiden Surname: HUNTER
GRO Reference: 1894 J Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 917

MCPHAIL, MARY ANN
Mother's Maiden Surname: HUNTER
GRO Reference: 1896 D Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 930

Do you have the family in 1911?
Where is Catherine Hope in 1939, and do you know when she died?
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby ianbee » Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:59 pm

Perhaps it says "04" rather than "94"

MCVEIGH, CATHERINE
Mother's maiden surname: HUNTER
GRO Reference: 1904 J Quarter in CHORLTON Volume 08C Page 984
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Re: Not shown on 1939 Register - 20 years old, reason?

Postby ianbee » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:27 pm

Harold + Catherine Hope in Stockport, Cheshire, in 1939.
The birth registrations of Harold junior and Raymond have mmn McPhail.
Looks to me like Catherine's d-o-b is 4th April 04. Matching the McVeigh registration in Chorlton in June 1904.
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