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Help with birth apparently not registered

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Help with birth apparently not registered

Postby Annylou » Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:42 pm

Hello!
I have been researching my family history for some time but so far have mainly stuck to Ancestry and Find My Past. I haven't had to go much further afield for F/H information.
I expect I made the same mistakes as many new genealogists in the beginning and now I am getting birth. marriage and death certificates to prove events.
My grandparents details I already "knew" but I thought I'd get their certificates for completeness.
My grandfather's birthday was 18 January 1899 in Clerkenwell, Middlesex, but I can't find any entry in the GRO. The nearest was a Thomas William Lomas registered in Whitechapel, I got the certificate anyway but it wasn't him.
I went to see whether Islington local register office would have any details and went to search for a record of his birth but they only go back 100 years and refer you to the GRO.
I asked my Dad whether he had grandad's birth certificate and he said he did, but he wasn't sure where it was. He rang me (we don't live near each other) to say he'd got all the certificates but grandad's looked different, it said "Permit" at the top with a number, and is dated 1919. What could this permit be? I can't see it, and he said it's very fragile so he won't post it to me (fair enough) and things like photocopiers are too modern for him! So I'll have to wait until I visit him to see what this certificate is - any ideas?
And how should I go about searching for a certificate or is there unlikely to be one?
I've got his baptism record and although I am happy that the people I have on record as his parents are the right people (as they are within living memory) it's a bit annoying not to have his birth certificate !
Annylou
 
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Re: Help with birth apparently not registered

Postby meekhcs » Wed Feb 28, 2018 3:36 pm

Interesting, according to the 1911 census there were 8 children born to William and Emily, 4 of whom died. The other 4 are included on the census. I can only find births for the 2 oldest surviving children Annie and Frank Joseph. The 1901 census mentions Kathleen bn 1901. HOWEVER they were all baptisedaccording to the London Baptisms on Ancestry

View Record Annie Lomas 24 Oct 1883 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily Jane
View Record Frank Joseph Lomas 18 Mar 1885 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily Jane
View Record Harry Thomas Lomas 27 Oct 1886 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily Jane
View Record William James Lomas 16 Oct 1889 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily Jane
View Record Joseph Richard Lomas 4 May 1891 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily Jane
View Record Alfred George Lomas 7 Nov 1894 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily
View Record Thomas William Lomas 9 Feb 1899 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily Jane
View Record Kathleen Florence Lomas 12 Oct 1900 Clerkenwell St Philip Islington William James,
Emily Jane

You probably have all these but just in case. Cannot think of a valid reason for the non registration. The parents could have been fined fornon registration. I suspect the "Permit" may be a form of late registration
meekhcs
 
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Re: Help with birth apparently not registered

Postby Mick Loney » Wed Feb 28, 2018 5:21 pm

Annylou,
It is no consolation I know, but I am in the same position with my grandfather, who was born in Limehouse/Poplar in 1891. His brothers and sisters were all registered, but for some reason he wasn’t. Being the eldest, I thought he may have beat the wedding of his parents, so registered under his mothers name but this doesn’t appear to be the case. A close run thing though, they were married March and he was born in May :D
I keep meaning to get one of my cousins to visit Poplar register office, but from your comments, it may be a waste of time, as this case too is over 100 years. I don’t even have his christening record, as being Catholic, they are hard to come by.

Can’t get too despondent though, as my GreatGrandfather was still around when I was 17! He died aged 93 - I should be so lucky :D
Mick Loney
 
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Re: Help with birth apparently not registered

Postby Annylou » Wed Mar 07, 2018 12:39 pm

Thanks folks, I guess it will just remain a mystery! When I look at this permit that Dad says he has it might give a few more clues. I suspect that registering births wasn't done quite as rigorously all that time ago!

and thanks for the info meekhcs :-)
Annylou
 
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Re: Help with birth apparently not registered

Postby meekhcs » Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:08 pm

Ironically, since replying to your post, I have come against a similar problem with one of my gg Grandmothers.

Years ago, when I originally roughly worked up my Family Tree I didn't realise there was a problem as I made a fact fit the circumstance, albeit with a series of ???. Now, with the benefit of many more years of FH researching under my belt, upon revisiting the birth I have realised that the original record I found for her was wrong, and that she was in fact illegitimate. Her birth wasn't registered at all. Three years after her birth, and her Mother having married and had a legitimate child with her husband, my gg Grandmother and her older, also illegitimate and unregistered, sister were baptised along with their step sister, and took their step Father's surname.

Mike - if you know the RC church he was baptised in it may be worth a contact. Many churches keep hold of their registers. I did just that with a relative in East Lulworth and was delighted to receive copies of two baptisms acouple of years ago that took place in the 1840s -Sally
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