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Edward Skeffington Quinn, born Antrim 1842-44

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Edward Skeffington Quinn, born Antrim 1842-44

Postby RobRog » Wed Feb 07, 2018 4:48 pm

I have traced my family back as far as Edward Skeffington Quinn, who was a sergeant in first the 37th, and then the 62nd Regiments, and served extensively in India. Where we have been able to trace all his offspring.

However, I am struggling to get further in his history. His Marriage certificate suggests a birthdate of 1844, and lists his father, Patrick, as a 'gentleman'. His discharge records suggest he was born in 1842 in Antrim.

The 1861 census has a Pvt Edward Quinn born in 1842 in Colchester Barracks. (where the 37th Depot was based)

But beyond that things get sketchy. I'm new to this genealogy, and not sure what is a leap too far?

A Patrick Quinn married Jane Reid in Antrim in 1842 and the give birth to an Edward Quinn.

Should I be looking for this Patrick Quinn in the 37th Reg? There is one and his discharge records place him in Nova Scotia for 2 years and then Ceylon for 9. The movements of the 37th reg would fit with him being in Ireland during this period. Though the main depot was in Limerick and Tipperary.

(Interestingly Edward himself returns to Antrim for the 1871 census where he is seconded to the Depot there from the 37th. So, could Patrick be on secondment in Belfast? Is that a common thing?)

In 1843 the 37th are in Dublin, and in that year there is a record of death for a Jane Quinn.

The Patrick Quinn in the 37th would then have gone out to Ceylon via Chatham. If he did have a child would this child have gone to a poor house? There is a record for an Edward Quinn born 1842 in Ireland, in Central London District School in Croydon in the 1851 census.

The questions I have are?

Are these links a bit speculative?

Would it follow that a child would go into the same regiment as his father, even after being left in a Poor House?

That he never went beyond sergeant would suggest that 'gentleman' as his fathers occupation was perhaps not truthful? Or he was illegitimate?

If he was illegitimate, would chasing a Patrick Quinn be a futile effort?

The middle name Skeffington was passed down 3 more generations, but the significance of it has been lost? He also gave other middle names like Carden, and Montagu to his children. Could these be military figures? They don't sound like Poor House kind of names?

Could 'Gentleman' refer to gentleman farmer? Could Patrick have come from somewhere like County Clare (as records for the Patrick Quinn in the 37th suggest), where prior to the famine they had been Gentlemen Farmers?

Any help greatly appreciated. I've thoroughly enjoyed researching this!
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Re: Edward Skeffington Quinn, born Antrim 1842-44

Postby Sylcec » Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:31 pm

Interesting post. I suspect that you are drawing too many speculative histories - why are you suggesting that Edward's father Patrick, was also in the 37th Regiment?
You did say:
A Patrick Quinn married Jane Reid in Antrim in 1842 and the give birth to an Edward Quinn.

Where did you find this information and what are the full details on the marriage and baptism records? This would seem to tie in with the known facts about Edward. I wouldn't worry about the 2 year variance in his stated year of birth. This is not necessarily significant and can often be accounted for by the time of year in which an age was stated and the birth happened.

You also refer to Edward as "even having been left in the poor house" - where did this idea come from, as it is not mentioned earlier as a fact?

"Gentleman" is a man of independent means, an "esquire". However the word tends to be used rather freely, often as in your case to describe the status of a father on a marriage certificate. I have one myself! So, unless you know for certain sure that the person was a gent, suggest you take it with a 'pinch of salt'.
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Re: Edward Skeffington Quinn, born Antrim 1842-44

Postby RobRog » Thu Feb 08, 2018 12:42 am

Thanks for your reply. I've been going into some more details and think I could be being a little optimistic.

I was looking in the 37th because his own son followed into his regiment when he was in India. He came home with most of his family, but one son stayed on as a child. I wondered if this common?

Some things I have uncovered this evening though...

- The record in Belfast 1842 spells the name as Quin.

- His daughter, in her marriage certificate spells her name as Quin also.

- The poor house link is speculation, but interestingly is Quin as well.

- I had thought Quin was the protestant variation, but both Patrick's marriage and Edwards baptism are on Catholic parish registers.

- Edward is listed in Maud's certificate as a gentleman also. As we know he was a lifelong soldier and only ever an NCO, I will take both with a pinch of salt as you say.
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Re: Edward Skeffington Quinn, born Antrim 1842-44

Postby ciderdrinker » Fri Feb 09, 2018 12:51 pm

I think you've done very well to trace what you have.
I agree the Patrick Quin(n) looks a good match and entry into the same regiment would fit nicely.
I'm a bit doubtful of that 1851 census .The poor law boards were quite keen to save money and taking a child they didn't have to ,from a different area would be unlikely.
On the census for 1851 it gives birthplace unknown but surely they would have know if it was Ireland and there is a Thomas Quin age 12 above him which looks like a brother.
Only a limited number of wives would go with the regiment abroad ,usually picked by lot and the children would go with them.

If Jane was dead either the children would stay with relatives,go to the local Poor House or Patrick would have had to remarry quite quickly.And given that there are no more children it does look like you have the right burial for Jane.

As for the gentleman bit ,that would probably be after Patrick left the regiment and retired on a pension.So no job therefore a Gentleman.
Tracing Patrick of the 37th foot in the pay books for his pension ,discharged 1856 he is in Portsmouth by 1861,Chatham 1862 and 1868 takes a ship to Melbourne and then Sydney where he appears until 1877.
The 1861 census seems to be him at Portsea
Patrick Quinn 43 married Civil Guard born Co Clare.

So it looks like he did remarry.
Also in Portsea is this household 1861
Mary Quinn married 32 Ireland
Mary Ann 10 scholar Ceylon
Ellen 3 Dartmoor
Julia 1 Portsea

Perhaps the rest of the family?
The mother's maiden name for the youngest 2 is Gleeson.
Julia Elizabeth Teresa's baptism at St John's Cathedral gives her father as Patrick 20.6.1860 birth 29th April 1860.
Ellen's birth certificate Tavistock Mar 1858 may give him as a Chelsea pensioner .
Looks like there are no more children in England before that.

There are 2 possible deaths in Sydney.
Patrick Quinn 1878 s of Richard and Elizabeth
Patrick Quinn 1879 Sydney James and Margaret
I'd d be inclined to go for the latter but that's just a guess the full death certificate would give you the details,his arrival ,wife etc.

(Beware -There is another Patrick Quinn born 1815 in Clare as he is convicted of sheep stealing in 1838).

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Re: Edward Skeffington Quinn, born Antrim 1842-44

Postby RobRog » Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:51 pm

Ciderdrinker, that is very impressive tracking of that Patrick. I had some of those details, but had lost him after 1861. It makes sense if he went to Sydney.

One suspicion I had for him was a marriage in South Wales in 1845 I think. Which is where the 37th was posted in that year.

Ancestry website suggested that a Patrick Quinn married one of a few names from the register, and Mary Gleeson was one of those names. I had been debating whether or not to buy that certificate for full details. It had felt speculative.

Is it possible to say that this Patrick Quinn from the 37th, is one and the same Patrick Quin? If it is then his wedding certificate to Mary Gleeson will be a real insight.

I had another speculative thought surrounding the brother Thomas Quinn from the poor house. In 1861 there is a Thomas Quinn in the 37th in Colchester with Edward. They have the same age difference. He was discharged injured.

Chasing that line, I found once and never again, a record for a Thomas Quinn (same age gap) born in Nova Scotia in the years that Patrick Quinn of the 37th was there. But I have never been able to find it again.

Could there have been brothers that ended up in the same regiment? (even if they're not our brothers??)

But surely if Mary Gleeson had gone out to Ceylon with the regiment and had Mary Anne there, they would have taken Edward (and if he is a real brother, Thomas) with them?

Could they have been left at a Poor House in transit to Chatham?
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Re: Edward Skeffington Quinn, born Antrim 1842-44

Postby ciderdrinker » Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:52 am

The pension records do state that the Patrick Quin/n from the 37th Regiment is paid in Sydney and if you've found a marriage for 1845 go for it!.
The marriage should give Patrick's occupation,hopefully his regiment and parents which would all be terrific.
I t does look like they are all the same family.
Fingers crossed that marriage certificate will have lots of info

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