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Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

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Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:02 pm

Help!

I am researching the ABLEY family of my 2x Great Grandmother, in the area around Clun, Knighton, Presteigne and Wigmore in the Welsh Marches. I have been very fortunate, as a very high proportion of them have left Wills (in English), going back to my 11x Great Grandfather in 1572.

My 9x Great Grandparents had 6 sons in Hopton Castle, Shropshire between 1608 and 1624, and the middle 4 are named in their father's Will in 1663.

Their oldest son was John ABLEY. I have found nothing about him except his Christening in St Mary's, Hopton Castle on 11 December 1608. It is possible that he died and was buried in St Mary's during the approx. 6½ year gap in the Parish Records during the late Civil War/early Commonwealth period.

However, a distant cousin with whom I am sharing research, has alerted me to an Administration (Admon.) for a John ABLEY, dated 11 March 1647. John apparently died abroad, and his estate was administered by his widow or relict, Elizabeth. Because he died abroad, the Admon. was dealt with by the Prerogative Court of Canterbury (PCC). I have attached an image of the printed Index for this.

I have absolutely no idea as to whether or not this man is identical to my distant cousin. However, the date would fit, and he is unlikely to be too far removed from my family line anyway. Consequently, I want to see if I can find out more. My problem is that I have no idea as to how to proceed.

I have discovered that Series PROB 54 in the National Archives is entitled: 'Prerogative Court of Canterbury: Administration Bonds from 1601 to 1713', and I wonder if this will hold the surviving papers that I want to see. It has not yet been indexed, according to NA's 'Discovery' site, so presumably I would need to go to London and look at it.

I would be grateful if anyone can tell me if this NA Series PROB 54 IS the place I need to look for my 1647 Admon., or if not, where I should go.

Many thanks,

Jane
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby AdrianB38 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:47 pm

It's complicated... But you probably guessed that. I've had to look at Mark Herber's Ancestral Trails for this, but I think that the summary is something like this:

1. The Admons are recorded in Act Books in (for your stuff) PROB 6. These are in Latin and there are lots of finding aids and indexes at Kew and other places. It may be that the text you refer to (not attached by the way) might be from one of these indexes.

I have no idea how much detail there is in one of these Act Books - I wouldn't be surprised if it's just one line per Admon.

2. PROB 54 contains bonds for the Admons - you know(?) the sort of thing - X the relict of the above promises to administer the estate fairly or pay £n. I'm guessing (note!) that most of the details will be in here. Not sure if '54 contains bonds for all Admons.

3. There may be inventories of the estate in PROB 2 to 5, 31, 32, 37.

I would really recommend sitting down with a detailed book like Herber's before turning up at Kew. I could easily have got some of the above wrong.

Note for anyone else - the above refers to Jane's specific case and is not a general description.

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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby ianbee » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:17 pm

Index to Acts of Administration in the Prerogative Court of Canterbury 1631-1648
(British Record Society, vol 100)
ABLEY, Jn., d. overseas. To Eliz. A., rel. 11 Mch. 1647, p.40.

The LDS seem to have filmed the Act Books, and a lot of the films have been digitized. So it might be worth a visit to a local FHC before going to London to seek out the actual administration?
Province of Canterbury. Prerogative Court
Admon. Act Books 1647-1648
British Film 93254
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby AdrianB38 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:53 pm

ianbee wrote:... British Film 93254


Not sure where Jane is (though maybe her id gives us a clue?) but according to the FamilySearch catalogue https://www.familysearch.org/catalog/search, the above film has been digitised but you need to be at an FHC or affiliated library to see the images. The Society of Genealogists in London counts as an affiliated library I understand. They also "inherited" the films from the FHC that had been lodging at Kew - but the catalogue shows that 93254 is not in that lot.
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:37 pm

Thank you very much both Ian and Adrian, there is a lot of food for thought here.

Yes, the British Record Society material is the quote I referred to from the Index Book Ian (for some reason, I could not load up the page of the Index), and yes Adrian, I am based in N Devon! Though I am also a member of the Soc of Genealogists, as we do occasionally get up to London. I guess I could ask them if they can help if it looks as though some or all of the material might be held there. I can also ask whether the LDS film is available elsewhere (I seem to recall seeing that there have been some changes to their service recently) as we used to have an LDS centre in Exeter.

It is a good lesson for anyone else reading this post, that once you get out beyond the Censuses and the Certificates of BMD, the path is no longer as easy, but on the other hand, as I have discovered with my ABLEY Wills, the dividends are huge.

Thank you again both,

Best wishes,

Jane
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby MaureenE » Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:34 pm

There still appears to be a LDS Family History Centre at Exeter.

From the Family Search website https://www.familysearch.org/locations/

Exeter England Family History Center
Wonford Road Off Barrack Road
EXETER EX2 4UD

44 0 1392 250 723
Hours
Tues.10.30am-3pm; Thurs 11:30 - 4:30 (Drop-in or book a session); Thurs 4:30 - 9pm by appointment only; Fri 2pm - 5pm; Sat 2pm - 5pm; Phone 01392 250723 or email Mark Peoples; email,[omitted]
Notes
Enquiries please contact Mark Peoples; email, [omitted]

Cheers
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:42 pm

Yes, thanks Maureen, that is the address that I had too. I think they have moved in recent years. I have sent an email to Mr Peoples, and will update this post if I make any progress.

Thanks to everyone for their help.

Regards,

Jane
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby ianbee » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:09 pm

Might be more work to do on this!
Prerogative Court of Canterbury Administrations Vol. VI 1631-1648
British Record Society (BRS) volume 100
Published 1986

The background info on findmypast,
they are writing about "Sentences"
but end
Of recent years there has been a growing tendency to indicate the Historical or Calendar Year rather than the Civil Year for dates prior to 1752. Thus, all dates between 1st January and 24th March are, in this volume, dated in modern terms, e.g. 14th February of the Civil Year 1636 is here denominated 1637.

Does this mean that the admon was actually 11 March 1646? Old style. Or not?
If so, how is this reflected at TNA? Any thoughts?

And would it mean that the Probate Act would have been filmed by the LDS on mf 93253 (1641-46)
Sorry if I have misinterpreted what the BRS have done, I'm just not sure.

The other thing about the date is that there is a marriage at St Botolph Aldgate, 28 April 1647 of John Anthonie (or Anthome according to ancestry) to Elizabeth Abley, widdow (Elizabethe on FamilySearch)

Does it say they were both of Rotherhithe? Answer, maybe!
Obviously, we don't know which Abley Elizabeth was the widow of, but there was a marriage at Rotherhithe, 19 November 1629, between John Abley and Elizabeth Curtis.
Ian
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Thu Nov 16, 2017 1:17 pm

Thank you very much Ian. This looks quite complex. I am conscious of the problems thrown up by 'double date years', as some sites use one system, and others the other, in terms of giving a date to things happening between Jan and mid March.

But the information from Rotherhithe is fascinating. There is a neat 'fit' about what you have discovered, although I know one should never jump to conclusions with Genealogy. As to whether my John ABLEY might have moved to Rotherhithe, well, why not? But also, equally, why?! This will need thought. But thank you so much for taking so much trouble.

Meanwhile, re my point above about checking out the doc in the FamilySearch Centre, I was right, things have changed quite recently - I think there was a report in the pages of the mag. Here is the body of the reply from Mark Peoples of the Exeter Centre, who responded very speedily:

.... Thank you for getting in touch. The current situation is that the due to advances in digital imaging equipment the films held by the church are now in the process of being digitised. As such many films have been made available online so films are no longer sent to Family History Centres, this stopped at the end of September 2017.

The process now is that you would need to search on FamilySearch.org to see if the film you need to see has been digitised, and if it is available for general viewing (at home online) or has to be viewed at a Family History Centre. Where it can be viewed is determined by copyright laws or other contracts. FamilySearch.org is completely free to use.

The goal is to have all films digitised by the end of 2020. If the film you require has not been done then a request for it to be digitised sooner can be made via FamilySearch.org.

If you would like to come along to the Family History Centre for help in searching for the film you require then we are open as follows:.....


So helpful, but not straightforward.

Again, I will update if I make progress.

Regards,

Jane
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Re: Acts of Administration in the PCC 1631-1648.

Postby Sylcec » Thu Nov 16, 2017 11:33 pm

I have just checked the Family History Library Catalog and the film you want has been digitised but with restrictions:

Admon. Act Books 1647-1648
Family History Library
British Film
93254
8226562
[This film is viewable with additional restrictions]
To view these images you must do one of the following:

Access the site at a family history center.
Access the site at a FamilySearch affiliate library.

So - you should be able to view this at the Exeter Family History Centre
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