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Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 1869.

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Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 1869.

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Tue May 02, 2017 4:38 pm

I am researching Charles LINGARD, born in Walsall in about 1836, the son of William LINGARD, a Tinner, and Ann LANGHAM. Charles lived in Walsall as a boy, and became a Plater and Tinner. On 20 February 1859, he married my distant cousin, Jane HUTCHINSON, at St Bartholomew's Parish Church, Edgbaston, Birmingham. They had a daughter, Sarah Ann, on 11 April, and she was Christened at Aston Juxta Parish Church on 1 May 1859. At that point, the family lived in Powell Street, Birmingham (probably with Jane's parents), and Charles still worked as a Tinner.

By the time of the 1861 Census, Jane and her baby daughter were living at home in Powell Street with Jane's parents, Thomas and Ann HUTCHINSON, but Charles was not present. Jane was still described as married, but by 1871, she was a widow, and in 1875, she remarried. When Sarah Ann married in 1880, she described her father Charles as a Harness Maker, which may or may not be relevant.

I searched for any sign of Charles, and the only trace I turned up in 1861, was of Charles LINGARD, a man of the correct age, married, with an occupation of Recruiting Sergeant, lodging in what looks like a pub or hotel in Stratford-upon-Avon. But his P/B is given not as Walsall, but as Birmingham. I CANNOT find any trace of a Charles LINGARD born in Birmingham in the right period, although there were LINGARDs living in the city in the 1830s.

My big question is whether this man is Jane's Charles?

I know who this man was, and I know his fate. He served as a Private in the 2nd Battalion, the 24th Regiment of Foot, which was then known as the 2nd Warwickshires. He was briefly in Cork with the Battalion in 1860, he was probably working out of the Bristol Recruiting Depot in 1861, and then almost certainly was posted with the Battalion to Mauritius, Burma and Secunderabad, India. The Battalion remained in India for some further years, but Private Charles LINGARD, aged 33 and 5/12ths (D/B April-May 1836) died in Aden or at sea close by, on 17 October 1869. He was buried in Steamer Point Burial Ground, Aden. The cause of death was Dysentery. It seems he was travelling home.

I have found a number of transcripts relating to Private Charles LINGARD, Service No 1070, on Ancestry and FindmyPast. They originate with various sets of papers in WO12 in National Archives. These are General Muster Books and Pay Lists. However, probably because he died instead of being pensioned off, there are no surviving Pension Records or other original papers. His date and cause of death are recorded on a Burial record, and his Death Certificate is highly unlikely to add anything material. I have no idea when or where he joined up. But I have little doubt that the man who died in Aden is the man in Stratford in 1861.

As I note above however, IS THIS MAN ALSO THE MAN MARRIED TO JANE???? Is there any way that I can determine this? I would be really grateful for any hints, advice or clues!

Regards,

Jane
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby AdrianB38 » Thu May 04, 2017 6:39 am

The only thing that comes immediately to mind - apart from trying to line up all the guys of the same name in the censuses, which you seem to have done - is that the WO 25 class at Kew contains various registers including Authorities to Deal with Soldiers Effects. WO 25/2968 is the sample I looked at, but that's back in the Napoleonic wars era though I'd expect others to be vaguely in that vicinity of piece number.

Anyway, if a soldier died, the Army had to know where to send things like outstanding payment. It failed with my guy because he owed them money but if someone can look at the corresponding register at Kew for your chap, then you might find a next of kin.

I have no idea whether those registers were still around at the time that you need or how they are arranged but it is a thought....

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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Thu May 04, 2017 10:38 am

Thanks Adrian, that sounds like an avenue that would be well worth exploring. I will see how much I can discover about the class, and whether there is coverage for soldiers in the late 1860s. I know it existed during WW1, as I have found family members who had died, and they appeared in Registers of Soldiers Effects on the genealogy websites.

Thank you,

Jane
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby peter kent » Fri May 19, 2017 7:41 am

Don't ignore the possibility that he simply abandoned his family.

Jane may have felt justified by 1871 - seven years having elapsed - to describe herself as a widow.

By the way, it may just be a typo but you say "Aston Juxta Parish Church". It's either "Aston Parish Church" or "Aston juxta Birmingham Parish Church". "Juxta" means "next to". I only mention it in case it helps in future.
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Fri May 19, 2017 2:02 pm

Hi Peter,

Many thanks. Yes, you are absolutely correct, I have considered the possibility that he might well have just abandoned his family, perhaps leaving quite quickly after the marriage and birth. But even if he DID abandon them, he still had to be somewhere. What I am doing is trying to discover what he did and where he went, and his eventual fate, whatever that was.

Now I am also aware that many who walked out on their wife/husband and kids in this period, changed their name or otherwise tried to escape discovery. But of these, many did not go far, and whilst they may have done enough to escape detection at the time they lived, they cannot so easily escape the search engines of the 21st Century!!

It is pretty clear, from all the evidence, that there was, quite probably, no subsequent contact between Jane and Charles, and Jane may well have felt safe to describe herself as a Widow, even though Charles might have been alive somewhere. On the other hand, the dates do fit nicely if the Charles who died in Aden WAS her husband. And he could well have been in the Army because he had abandoned Jane and his daughter.

I am actually doing this research for both myself and 2 HUTCHINSON cousins. I have discovered that Dead Soldiers Effects files do exist for the period, in the National Archives, and one of my cousins is hoping to pursue this avenue for us all. What we want to do is try to prove definitively whether this was Jane's husband.

And yes, you are quite correct that 'juxta' means 'next to', and grammatically it is Aston-juxta-Birmingham Parish Church. But when did a little thing like grammar bother a Brummie - we all know the church just as 'Aston Juxta'! If you are talking football of course, you never juxtapose the words 'Aston' and 'Birmingham' anyway!

Actually, I did deliberately add the words 'Parish Church' as a clarification for anyone not familiar with the geography and history of the city. For those who do not know it, this handsome medieval Church (in fact dedicated to St Peter and St Paul), stands just behind Villa Park, the home of Aston Villa Football Club. You can also see it - it has a very tall elegant spire - from the motorway. It was mucked about with by the Victorians, but is still well worth a visit. My 4 x Great Grandfather died in Almshouses close to the church in 1839, and many ancestors were Christened, buried and married there, from the mid 18th Century onwards.

Regards,

Jane
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby MaureenE » Fri May 19, 2017 11:15 pm

When in the Army, he would have had no choice as to whether his family accompanied him.

For soldiers deployed from Britain to overseas garrisons only a proportion of men were allowed to be accompanied by their wives. For most countries the proportion was six wives per one hundred soldiers. However for India, and Australia, the ratio was twelve wives per one hundred men, including NCOs. The number of children was unlimited. I think the eligible wives may have been selected by a ballot, but I don't have details on this.

Wives in this context means "on the strength wives", where approval for marriage had been given by the Army, and the wife lived at the barracks.

If Jane was an Army wife, it sounds very much as though she would not have been "on the strength" so she would not have been eligible even to be considered to accompany her husband,.

Cheers
Maureen
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby Brummie on Exmoor » Sat May 20, 2017 10:29 am

Thank you Maureen, this is really useful material. I knew in general terms about Army Wives, but this specific detail is invaluable, and not just in this case. If this Charles is ours, it does add an insight, that if Charles and Jane decided together that he should join up, she probably had little option but to move back in with Mum and Dad, and wait with fingers crossed that Charles would finally come home safely.

I think my one big reservation about Charles (and Jane) making the decision to join the army as a logical step in building their nuclear family (I know that is a rather 21st Century concept, but people have taken decisions about the best way to improve their lot, throughout history) is that Charles was a skilled man in civilian life. His father was a Journeyman Tinner in Walsall, an older brother was a Brass Dresser, he himself worked as a Plater/Tinner before moving to Birmingham. Of course, he might have had difficulty finding work, but joining the army and going away for years was a pretty radical step. It tends to smack more of a man trying to distance himself, or even actually disappear from view. But of course, none of this is certain.

Thank you again.

Jane
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby Lettie » Wed Nov 07, 2018 1:53 pm

Hello

Shot in the dark here but I am trying to search my great grandfather Charles Herbert Lingard who has a link to Birmingham . He fathered my grandfather who was born in Aston in 1914 . His mother was from Gibraltar and cane over to Aston to give birth .She had told family she married Charles Herbert Lingard in Sept 1913 but there are no records. I can find . She then seemed to be widowed .However I don’t think she was married at all to him . I have had my dna done on ancestry your story could be linked to mine .would love to get in touch see if we can find connection as I seem to have hit a brick wall . I have just got a copy of grandfathers birth certificate which names father and address in Birmingham . Hopeful Collette Lingard
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby ianbee » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:10 pm

Lettie wrote:His mother was from Gibraltar and cane over to Aston to give birth .She had told family she married Charles Herbert Lingard in Sept 1913 but there are no records

Married in Gibraltar, 29 September 1913
Charles Herbert Lingard
+
Adela Martinez

Index card (need to be logged in)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903 ... cat=440722
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Re: Private Charles LINGARD, 24th Foot, died in Aden, Oct 18

Postby ianbee » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:26 pm

The only other Lingard marriage indexed in Gibraltar is on the previous image
Adela Lingard
+
Sidney Almore
16 May 1921

Should that be Elmore perhaps?
Is it the same Adela?
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