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Marriage Registers Bill (2017)

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Re: Marriage Registers Bill (2017)

Postby junkers » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:47 pm

AntonyM wrote:Assuming it does get into the Commons (and it was a Tory promise to do it) , I can't see many MPs wanting to vote against it ....why would they ?


The clever bit about this is that is uses an existing system, the sad part is that it does away with marriage registers but that means they they don't all need to be replaced and overall actually saves money. No cost implications for churches at all ...


The Government would have their supporters (MPs) and may not like some of the provisions and all they have to do is to get an MP to 'talk it out' (how may Private Member Bills have been passed recently?). There is part of the issue over money (is it just to save money?), also people consider signing the marriage register book as part of the ceremony, should we deprive them of that?. I notice that the Impact Statements relative to the Bill cannot be accessed on the Parliament website, that the Bill still needs a Money Resolution and that the Secretary of State has the power to decide when the system would be introduced. As Guy has said it leaves too many loopholes whereas the present system seems to work ok. I don't understand this issue of the Schedule and the reference to Scotland re Civil Partnerships as this is required to be signed and received before a Marriage (see National Records of Scotland website).
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Re: Marriage Registers Bill (2017)

Postby AntonyM » Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:06 pm

The proposal adopts the system already in use for civil partnerships - where there is no physical register.

Quite a clever solution - because it actually reduces the paperwork involved in the process, and avoids the cost of withdrawing and reissuing thousands of registers to every religious venue. I believe this cost was a major stumbling block delaying the change.

Can't see many MPs wanting to be the one who argues against it.
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Re: Marriage Registers Bill (2017)

Postby AdrianB38 » Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:18 pm

I'm not sure what the reference to Scotland above is about, but I'd just like to point out that all the images of marriages on ScotlandsPeople show documents created after the actual marriage, effectively when registering the marriage after the event. Indeed, post marriage registration seems typical across the world, witnessed by the number of American genealogists who assume that's the situation in England and Wales so go looking into the possibility of marriages taking place but not being registered.

Regardless, I have to say that I much prefer registration during the ceremony as a much more robust process.

I think that I've said before that you don't need expensive book renewal to get the mother's name in - just write smaller!

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Re: Marriage Registers Bill (2017)

Postby junkers » Mon Nov 27, 2017 6:03 pm

Here are the Impact Assessments (now on the Parliamentary website) https://www.parliament.uk/documents/imp ... 17-011.pdf

The Church will lose a small amount of cash (£2 per quarter) but the Home Office seems to be worried about the burglaries (and rightly so) in churches but IT systems are notorious over the IT security and there is one other issue which is the marriage registers would no longer be deposited in record offices!, a point family historians are interested in.
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Re: Marriage Registers Bill (2017)

Postby AdrianB38 » Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:35 pm

Well, we live with birth and death certificates not being deposited at Record Offices so I guess we can live with marriages not being. Though obviously it'll cost us - or our successors - more. Maybe we should persuade the GRO to stop being so ***** precious about historical registers and deposit the things on open access! (Though I'm not sure how many Record Offices have the space!)

I do worry about the risks of schedules going missing between wedding and registration. It would be interesting to know from experience in Scotland whether that is a material risk.

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Re: Marriage Registers Bill (2017)

Postby junkers » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:32 pm

I see that the Home Office will support this Private Members' Bill (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42919441) its only taken 183 years!. Of it has been commonplace for both names (where known) in Scotland since 1855 and I think in Ireland since 1864. I still think not having it in a book is a backward step, its part of the country's history and culture. In future family historians won't be able to look up a physical marriage register, shame!.
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