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Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

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Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby neergydna » Fri Mar 10, 2017 5:57 pm

The above has provided my uncle and myself with a brickwall. We know his date of birth and that his parents were James Stephen Roberts and his wife Alice, nee Scott and that his birth was registered in St Saviour, Southwark, London. After his father's death in 1906 and his mother's death in 1907, he was 'taken into care' and was placed into Hanwell School until his discharge in 1914 apart from a spell at institutions in Brentwood and Margate. That is where the trail goes cold. My uncle has a photo that he inherited which shows a young man in army uniform which he believes is the mysterious Arthur but he has not been able to ascertain from the photo any details of the regiment from the uniform.

I have searched the 1939 Register but there is not an Arthur Roberts with the correct date of birth. I have also sent for the death certificate of an Arthur Roberts with the correct date of birth who died in Havering in 1989. However the place of birth was West Midlands which seems a bit vague even though his son was the informant.

1. Any clues to when or whether Arthur enlisted into the services.

2. Did he emigrate? His older brother went to Canada as a Fagan boy in 1910 aged 17.

3. Did he marry?

4. When did he die?

My uncle is in his 80s and would like to find out to his uncle Arthur who he may or not have met as a child.

Andy
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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby ianbee » Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:35 pm

The only Arthur Roberts I can see born in March qtr 1900 in the West Midlands is Arthur Alfred in Aston. Who may have died same area 1967.
Even looking a year either side of 1900 doesn't change the situation much.
Have you got enough info to trace a marriage for the Havering Arthur?
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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby neergydna » Fri Mar 10, 2017 6:56 pm

Ian

I came to the same conclusion. Also his date of birth on the 1939 Register is 28 January 1900 and he was living in Birmingham.

However there is an Arthur Roberts born in Kettering registered in the same quarter which is stretching West Midlands a bit, or another born in Atcham which is just outside Shrewsbury.

The only information from the death certificate is that his son was Peter James Roberts and they lived at 153 Bentry Road, Dagenham.

Andy
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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby neergydna » Fri Mar 10, 2017 7:12 pm

Ian

I have just found out that Arthur Roberts born in Atcham died soon after his birth so it is not him.

Andy
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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby Sylcec » Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:44 pm

I am slightly confused here - the original post says that Arthur James Roberts was born in south London (birth registered in St Saviour, Southwark) with names of parents etc - from which I had the impression that Andy has a copy of the birth certificate and other corroborating evidence.
In my experience, dates of birth as shown in the 1939 register are often incorrect as to the YEAR of birth, though may show the correct day and month.
Checking back I see that JOHN (not James) Stephen Roberts, age 39, married Alice Jane Scott, age 20, 15 Feb 1880 at Camberwell. The family in 1901 appears to be:
John Roberts Head M Male 60 1841 General Labourer Chelsea, Middlesex,
Alice Roberts Wife M Female 40 1861 Jam Factory Hand Wolverton, Bucks
Minnie Roberts Daughter Single Female 15 1886 - Deptford,
Alice Roberts Daughter Single Female 12 1889 - Deptford,
Florence Roberts Daughter Single Female 10 1891 - Deptford,
Frederick Roberts Son Single Male 7 1894 - Deptford,
Arthur Roberts Son Single Male 1 1900 - Southwark, Surrey,

Have you - Andy - been able to trace what became of all of Arthur's siblings?

Is it worth your while posting a copy of the photo of the young man in army uniform in case one of the experts on here may be able to identify the regiment?
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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby Mick Loney » Sat Mar 11, 2017 8:33 am

Other points to ponder.

Does your birthdate for Arthur come from a certificate? Parents registering late, 'adjusted' the registered birthdate so it looked legal, so avoiding a fine for registering late. My own father was born 18 December, and I was gob-smacked when I saw his birth certificate, which showed his registered birtdate was 31 December!

As for dates in 1939 register, I have also seen cases where the 'Year' born was incorrectly shown! Especially if age diference of husband and wife was large! It was sometimes adjusted to look more reasonable!


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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby ianbee » Sat Mar 11, 2017 11:59 am

Newington Workhouse (St Saviour Southwark BG)
admitted Wednesday August 28th 1907
Roberts, Arthur, 31.1.00
Was discharged from there, along with a load of other children, to Hanwell School, 12 Sep 1907

Possible earlier school record?
Orange Street School, Southwark
admitted 11.6.06
Roberts Arthur
d-o-b 1.1.00
Parents/Guardians - Father Dead, Alice (Charwoman)
address 195 Stanhope B

So there is a discrepancy in those two dates of birth.

No surprise, the Children's Receiving Homes, Boyson Road, has Arthur's d-o-b as 31.1.00
Southwark Board School Admission Order Book -
12th September 1907
Central London Schools Hanwell
Roberts Arthur
31.1.00 (curiously it says his age is 6)
Parish of S Geo
Religion C E
Sister Mrs Mansell, 93 Park St Southwark
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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby Sylcec » Sun Mar 12, 2017 1:55 am

This looks like Arthur's sister getting married:
1905, September qtr
Mansell William Benjamin Southwark 1d 137
ROBERTS Minnie Southwark 1d 137

Actually this marriage is in the Ancestry London Parish Register series. It took place on 2 July 1905 at St Mary Magdalene, Southwark. Both of Minnie Roberts' parents were witnesses at the wedding. William Mansell was age 20 and a warehouseman.
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Re: Arthur James Roberts born 31 January 1900

Postby neergydna » Wed Mar 15, 2017 8:23 pm

Thank you everyone for your replies. Between us my uncle and I already had the information quoted.

Sylcec - Through his mother, my uncle kept in touched with his aunts so knows what happened to the. He also was in touch with his uncle who went to Canada. It just seems that the aunts did not talk about their brother, Arthur.

Anyway, we will keep on researching Arthur and hopefully find out something else about him.

Andy
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