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Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby sdup26 » Wed Jan 25, 2017 11:12 am

As you know, in the 1841 census, only those under 15 had their exact ages recorded. Everyone else was supposed to have their age rounded down to the nearest five years. It's also possible that John left Tilberry Farm before 1846, as people can still be on an electoral register when they've moved away or died, simply because no-one told the authorities. So ages can be an unreliable guide, and possible deaths for John and Sarah could date from immediately after the 1841 census. None of which has helped the search so far!
Assuming they were both still alive after 1841, they wouldn't have been divorced, as you rightly say. Even if your spouse was just a few miles away, you could probably get away with claiming to be a widower. Who would bother to check? The fact that the death cert you have for a Sarah Chard describes her as wife of John Chard is interesting. But I worry about the occupation of John changing to 'butcher' in his later years, after a lifetime in agriculture. And why would he suddenly marry bigamously after years of living together? Incidentally, you refer to a John Chard marrying a Charlotte, but in your last post, you say he may have felt justified in marrying 'Rebecca.' Slip of the keyboard?
I'm curious about the John Chard aged 8 in 1841. Sarah is listed as 60, so probably nearer 65, and Mary as 20, so could be 25. Sarah is unlikely to be John's mother, so is it Mary? He isn't with Mary and James in 1851, but would have been about 18 by then. I just wondered if he was a possible 'clue' to John and Sarah's whereabouts.
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby philmcleod47 » Wed Jan 25, 2017 11:46 am

Reply to sdup26
I share your concerns regarding John being a butcher in 1851 census, although butchery is loosely connected to farming. However the marriage certificate of John & Charlotte in 1853 shows John was a farmer and on his death certificate it does state he was a Yeoman (farmer with land). On Sarahs death cert it states she was wife of John Chard, a Yeoman. So it does look like the John who married Charlotte (yes, it was Charlotte, not Rebecca) could well have been the husband of Sarah, irrespective of the 1851 census. It is certainly possible that the 1851 census is for a different John but no other records can be found. The absence of any other plausible records, census or deaths makes this scenario difficult to disprove.
I have obviously searched everywhere on line and have also paid Somerset Archives to search the electoral rolls and search for burials where deaths may not have been properly registered.
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby sdup26 » Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:44 pm

As with everything concerned with family history, you never stop looking and checking, but for what it's worth, your research seems sound, and in your shoes, I'd go with it unless something absolutely concrete to the contrary turns up.
You've probably got this Uffculme marriage banns entry, but in case not:
Banns between John Chard, living in Clayhidon, and Sarah White living in this parish, were read on Jun 12th, 19th and 26th,1806.
Do you think it could be significant that Clayhidon is only about 9 mils from Honiton, where there was a baptism for a John Chard 14/4/1790, father Edward, mother Sarah?
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby philmcleod47 » Wed Jan 25, 2017 7:28 pm

Yes I have John & Sarahs marriage in Uffculme.
As for Johns baptism that is still a mystery as on the marriage certificate to Charlotte it gives Johns fathers name as John. On the 1851 census the birthplace of John was Hemyock and the John Chard born there in 1780 had a father William. This indicates that whilst the deaths and remarriage to Charlotte are still valid it casts doubts on the 1851 census record as being correct John. Again I can find no other 1851 record for a John Chard but will keep searching.
I do not like to put details in my tree without them being beyond reasonable doubt
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby philmcleod47 » Wed Jan 25, 2017 8:26 pm

Progress but no further forward.
I have now discovered that the marriage of a John Chard to Charlotte Dyer is not my John.
Tracking Charlotte Dyer in 1851she lived in Milverton where there was a John Chard of the correct age married to Elizabeth. Elizabeth died in 1852 which was 6 months before Johns marriage to Charlotte.
So Johns remarriage in 1853 & death in 1860 is ruled out.
This puts me back to square 1 as I still have a Sarah that is a strong possibility, but no death of John after 1853. The census record of John in 1851 looks a strong possibility again, despite him being a butcher but where is Johns death?
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby ianbee » Thu Jan 26, 2017 10:51 am

Could he have gone back to Devon?
There is this death -
June 1855 Honiton 5b 27
Chard, John
age 75

Burial at Sidmouth, 27 May 1855
John Chard, abode Sidmouth, age 74

That could possibly be the first burial of a Chard in Sidmouth since 1713!
And there is no John Chard of that kind of age in Devon in the 1841 or 1851 census.
Nearest are the chap in Tiverton in 1841, age 75 (rounded), who seems to have been buried at Tiverton in September of the same year age 78
And the John Chard in Honiton, 49 in 1841, 60 in 1851, and possibly buried at Honiton in November 1861 (age 71)

If John did return to old haunts, there's mention in the Devon newspapers (sorry!) in May 1853 of a John Chard, "an elderly man", found guilty of assaulting a girl at Coombe Raleigh. He got six months.
EDIT Though that could have been the man in Honiton (seems to be have been recorded as James in 1861)
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Last edited by ianbee on Thu Jan 26, 2017 12:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby sdup26 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 11:36 am

I'm pleased for you that you've been able to eliminate one John, which seems to leave us with John the butcher. The more you look at the situation - John 'married' not widowed, working as a butcher on a large farm, and Sarah 'married' not widowed, working as a housekeeper a walkable 4 miles or so from John, the more it looks as if they were simply earning their livings apart. Or at least, apart on census night, which may not be the same thing.
I know you've been working on this for a long time, so you may have checked these deaths out. But here goes anyway:
Death of Sarah Chard Sept Q 1853 WellingtonS 5c 215 aged 77 - born about 1776.
Death of John Chard Sept Q 1860 WellingtonSom 5c 212 aged 77 - born about 1783.
If this is your couple, the informant of Sarah's age may have been John, but the informant of John's age probably had to guess at it.
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby philmcleod47 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:29 pm

The 2 deaths you mention are the 2 I have referred to previously. I have both death certificates. Sarah is the Sarah living on her own in 1851 as the place of death was only a mile away.
The John is the John who had married Charlotte, this was proved by a Will on Ancestry that gives the same date of death as the certificate and states he left a widow Charlotte.
I am now going back and looking again at deaths that were dismissed a couple of years ago when I ordered conditional certificates from GRO based on marital status, age etc. The GRO said nothing matched but experience since then tells me that GRO only do a quick glance and too easily say it does not fit.
There is one that is of great interest and that is the death of a John Chard in 1855, aged 74 registered in Honiton, buried in Sidmouth. The interest is that Mary (his daughter) & James McLeod were living in Sidmouth at that time so he may have been visiting or gone to live with them after Sarahs death in 1853. GRO said it did not fit when I ordered it conditionally before, but I have now ordered it normally and wait to see what information it actually gives. Incidentally, there were no John Chards in Sidmouth or anywhere near in 1851 census.
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby ianbee » Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:39 pm

ianbee wrote:There is this death -
June 1855 Honiton 5b 27
Chard, John
age 75

Burial at Sidmouth, 27 May 1855
John Chard, abode Sidmouth, age 74

That could possibly be the first burial of a Chard in Sidmouth since 1713!
And there is no John Chard of that kind of age in Devon in the 1841 or 1851 census.

Good to know that this death is of great interest!
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Re: Deaths of John & Sarah Chard

Postby sdup26 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 4:09 pm

You may have posted too quickly, missing ianbee's suggestion that you should investigate that John Chard death in Honiton (burial Sidmouth) and he is invariably right.
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