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Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

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Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby Mick Loney » Sun Nov 27, 2016 11:42 am

I am trying to help a distant cousin trace her Dowler line, and hit a brick wall with William and Elizabeth Dowler.

William Dowler (1821-1888) and his wife Elizabeth (1827-1894), can be found in 1861 & 1881 census, but cannot be found prior to 1861 nor 1871.

In 1861 they and their children can be found living in White Street North,Southwark, with the following details:

William (Head) born 1821 City of London, Cloth Cap Maker
Elizabeth (Wife) born 1827 Bristol, Cloth Cap Maker
William (Son) born 1845 Ormskirk, Lancashire, Cap Felter
James (Son) born 1851 Northampton, Cap Felter
Alice (Daughter) born 1852 Bristol
Rose (daughter) born 1856 Bristol
Elizabeth (daughter) born 1856 Southwark

As you can see, judging by birthplace of children, are very well travelled.

Their son William married in 1868 in Southwark RD
Their Son James married in 1870 in West Ham RD
Their daughter Alice married in 1873 in Bethnal Green RD, so I assume the family were still in the London area in 1871.

Despite my best efforts, I cannot find a christening for any of the children, nor a suitable marriage for William and Elizabeth, who is shown as 'Elizabeth Jane' on her death register entry in 1894. With no Christenings nor GRO registrations for the children, I don't even know if she is the mother of the children!

I think I have a christening for William in 1821 at St Saviour Southwark, but have no marriage to confirm who his father was, so do not know if this is correct christening.

Any help would be welcome
Mick Loney
 
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Re: Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby ianbee » Sun Nov 27, 2016 12:05 pm

Hi Mick
Are they under the name SHORT in 1871? In Clerkenwell
One or two promising birth registrations
Ian
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Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby Mick Loney » Sun Nov 27, 2016 12:59 pm

Ian,
I don't see that, what is the reference you found?

Edit. Found what you are referring to.
Must admit it looks promising, just have to work out hoe they got from dowler to short!

I wish FMP had facity to search on family forenames!

Now to find them in 1851:)

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Re: Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby Mick Loney » Sun Nov 27, 2016 4:59 pm

Ian,

What are the birth registrations you are referring to? I'm intrigued!


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Re: Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby ianbee » Sun Nov 27, 2016 5:10 pm

Hi Mick
Got a few of them now from the new index
June 1847 Ormskirk
Short, William John
mother Dee

March 1850 Northampton
Short, James Henry
mother Dee

Sep 1852 Clifton
Short, Alice
mother Dee

Seem to match the names, places of birth, and approximate ages of the first three Dowler children in 1861.
Then these birth registrations stop? Don't ask me what's going on!
Can't see anything in 1851.
John
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Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby Mick Loney » Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:33 pm

Ian, (whoops, I meant John)
The plot thickens. Can't wait to report back to my cousin, perhaps her dad will know of a family story that will throw some light on it. It has happened to me before, when an illegitimate child adopts the surname of a step-father. In one case permanently following his mother's marriage, the other couldn't decide, and swapped between the two!
I was really intrigued to find the circumstances to warrant the children being born in such widespread places.

Thank you for your help


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Re: Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby ksouthall » Sun Nov 27, 2016 10:52 pm

Mick Loney wrote:I was really intrigued to find the circumstances to warrant the children being born in such widespread places.


I have a few sets of siblings where the births occurred in a range of places. In one family the father was a soldier so the children were born in France, Devon & Hertfordshire. (He was originally from Lincolnshire.)

In another set of siblings, the family had the children en route as they migrated from Derbyshire to Hertfordshire via Leicestershire. They were nonconformist so that may also have had some bearing on available places for the children to be baptised. The father was a tenant farmer.

Another set of siblings had 3 born in Gloucestershire and 3 born in Hertfordshire, as they migrated across the country over 7 years. (There is a possibility that the first child was born in Devon but her birth was registered in Gloucestershire as she was born 4 days after her parents' wedding in Devon.) The father was a tenant farmer.

In another set, the father was a train driver so his children were born in Reading, Reigate and Brighton.
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Re: Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby Mick Loney » Mon Nov 28, 2016 6:29 am

Ksouthall,
I know where you're coming from, but these were 'Cloth Cap makers'! It wasn't a case of moving from a-b, stopping at c&d on the way, as William was born in the city, went round the country and ended up back at Southwark, very weird.
The change of surname is puzzling too, will need a little more digging me thinks :)


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Re: Where are the Dowlers pre-1861?

Postby ksouthall » Mon Nov 28, 2016 7:48 pm

Mick Loney wrote:I know where you're coming from, but these were 'Cloth Cap makers'! It wasn't a case of moving from a-b, stopping at c&d on the way, as William was born in the city, went round the country and ended up back at Southwark, very weird.


Could there have been a shortage of cloth which meant he had to move round? Or could he have been bankrupted or committed a crime so was forced to move to avoid and consequences, hence the change of name? Alternatively, the children could have been from more than one relationship. Perhaps he was a bigamist, which could also be an explanation for the change of name.

The Bristol births could have occurred when staying with or visiting Elizabeth's family as one of the census records shows her place of birth as Bristol.

I'll have a look and see if I can get any ideas.
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