Moderator Control Panel ]

AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

A problem shared is a problem halved. Post your brick walls here and see whether you can offer advice to others

AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby Sylcec » Thu Sep 15, 2016 10:00 am

This is a long-standing brick wall of mine.
In the 1851 and 1861 Thomas and Ann JAMES are living at Stapleford, Leicestershire. On both occasions Thomas is said to be born in Wymondham, Leics and Ann in Ailsworth, Suffolk.
I have a record of Thomas James baptism 10 August 1785. He dies last qtr 1867 Stapleford.

There does not appear to be any such place as Ailsworth in Suffolk, but have just discovered (google!) that a place of this name exists close to (? part of) Peterborough in Northants. Some sites say Cambridgeshire. However, it seems it was a hamlet rather than a parish, and I am not clear in which parish I would find baptism records relating to Ailsworth. Advice please?

Ann is my 3rd gt grandmother in the direct female line. She would have been born about 1780. Unfortunately I have also not been able to find a marriage between her and Thomas James, but know of 4 children born to them:
Gervase James, b. abt 1810 Wymondham (according to census, baptism not found)
Elizabeth James, bap 24 Jan 1814, Colsterworth, Lincs
Ann James, bap 22 Jun 1816, Colsterworth, Lincs
Martha James, bap 1 Sep 1818, Colsterworth, Lincs
Martha is my 2nd gt grandmother and marries John Bailey 5 July 1847 at Wymondham, Leics.

I should also add here that the Wymondham, Leics PRs are the worst kept that I have seen anywhere. The vicar still failed to record required details long after civil registration was instituted. When Martha James m John Bailey no fathers' names were recorded. Gervase James was one of the witnesses.
If anyone can suggest a possible marriage for Thomas and Ann, or where I can find PRs for Ailsworth I would be most appreciative.
User avatar
Sylcec
 
Posts: 2509
Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:36 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby Pennie » Thu Sep 15, 2016 11:25 am

According to Wikipedia, Ailsworth "lies within the ecclesiastical parish of Castor". I have checked both Family Search (IGI) and FreeREG but neither has transcriptions for marriages in Castor.

I have also checked (just in case) the Northamptonshire Marriage Index (1700-1837), but no likely marriage for Thomas and Ann there.

The parish registers for Castor are held at the Northamptonshire Record Office, which is located on the outskirts of Northampton*.

Pennie

* Oops! Just noted your location - so probably not a lot of help.
Pennie
 
Posts: 72
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:47 am

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby AntonyM » Thu Sep 15, 2016 11:54 am

There is no Ailsworth, but there is a parish of Halesworth in Suffolk ...it is in the east of the county near to Southwold.
AntonyM
 
Posts: 359
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2014 3:12 pm
Location: Buckinghamshire

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby Sylcec » Thu Sep 15, 2016 11:19 pm

Thank you Pennie - I may just order up the film for Castor and look through it.
Thank you AntonyM - some years ago I got the film for Halesworth, Suffolk PRs and went through all the baptisms 1770-1790 looking for an Ann who might be my ancestor. As I recollect (no notes of course), it was only a small parish and there was no Ann or Anne baptised within the time period.

Thomas James was an ag lab who moved around a bit looking for work, so he could have married a girl from Halesworth, Suffolk or Ailsworth, Northants (though the latter seems more likely to be in his circuit). They may have met at one of the hiring fairs - maybe time to check out the likely market towns. A baptism for Gervase James (?1810) may also help narrow things down. He often shows us on census as Jarvis James which sounds the same.
User avatar
Sylcec
 
Posts: 2509
Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:36 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby ianbee » Fri Sep 16, 2016 10:00 am

Sylvia, Leicestershire parish registers are being digitized by findmypast. It's not known exactly when they will be appearing online. But maybe that will help.
I don't think the LDS have ever filmed the Wymondham parish registers. They only list BT's in their catalogue. Film 596084, item 2.
Going by their England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975, there doesn't seem to be any gap in the BTs around 1810, but no entries come up for 1813 or 1814.

Castor, Northamptonshire, parish registers are available on ancestry
Ian
ianbee
 
Posts: 2292
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:51 pm

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby Sylcec » Fri Sep 16, 2016 10:04 pm

Ian - well, yes, it must have been the BTs for Wymondham, rather than PRs that I looked at. However, given what I remember of these and the deficient marriage certificate for daughter Martha James, I suspect that the actual PRs will not be much or any better. I think the incumbent had been at Wymondham all his life as a C of E minister and was not inclined to make changes.

I will check the Castor PRs on ancestry. Thanks.
User avatar
Sylcec
 
Posts: 2509
Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:36 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby AdrianB38 » Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:03 am

I may not have followed the details - but if you have a deficient marriage in the BTs, I wouldn't assume that it was deficient in the PRs. I have seen occasions in Cheshire where the BTs were done on plain paper and omitted anything other than the headline names and date. I think I've even seen BTs done on pre 1837 pages for post 1837 marriages - using up blank stock I guess.

Were you to find the PRs, you might be pleasantly surprised. On the other hand....

Sent from my MotoG3 using WDYTYA Forum mobile app
Adrian
AdrianB38
 
Posts: 2538
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2010 4:07 pm

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby Sylcec » Tue Sep 27, 2016 11:46 am

I have been reviewing my family file on this branch, and realise that I made an incorrect assumption some years ago. I had deduced that Gervase/Jarvis James was an older brother of my ancestor Martha James, based largely on him being a witness at her marriage in Wymondham, and that Thomas & Ann were living next to some NEEDHAMs (Jarvis married a Charlotte Needham).
This is a copy of Martha's marriage details:
Marriage certificate Marriage solemnised at the church in the parish of Wymondham in the County of Leicester
# 49, 5 July 1847
John Bailey, full age, bachelor, labourer, resident at Wing, Rutland by banns to
Martha James, full age, spinster, resident at Wymondham
by Richard Craff, Rector
Witnesses: Jane Bailey; Gervase James; Thomas Budenham Clark

Several family trees on Ancestry have Gervase/Jarvis born in Wymondham in 1807 to a father of the same name. So, again there is currently no proof, but it may be that he is a cousin of Martha's (fathers possibly brothers), but I no longer think he is an older brother.

This still leaves me not knowing the identity of Ann James (c.1780-1874), but causes me to revise a likely marriage year to Thomas James of 1812/13. The only children born to them are the 3 girls baptised at Colsterworth.
Sylvia
User avatar
Sylcec
 
Posts: 2509
Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:36 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby ianbee » Tue Sep 27, 2016 12:53 pm

Hi Sylvia
I think you are right not to assume that Jarvis/Gervase James in Wymondham must be a son of Thomas.
However, there were two of similar age around, so he could be!

Marriage, 6th June 1843, at North Burton, Yorkshire.
Jarvis James, full age, bachelor, Farm Servant, residence ?, father Jarvis James, Butcher
+
Mary Flinton

They are found in Durham in the census, Jarvis born Wymondham.
Death, Sep 1868 Hartlepool 10a 79
James, Jervis
age 61

Ian
ianbee
 
Posts: 2292
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:51 pm

Re: AILSWORTH - Ann James (nee ?) b. abt 1780

Postby Sylcec » Tue Sep 27, 2016 10:40 pm

Thank you Ian. Now that is interesting - so this Jarvis clearly can't be the same one who married Charlotte Needham in 1834, and is still having children with her in Leics in 1848.
I will certainly look forward to the original PRs for Wymondham coming available on-line.
User avatar
Sylcec
 
Posts: 2509
Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2008 4:36 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia


Return to General research queries


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests