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Born at Sea

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Re: Born at Sea

Postby nuttree » Thu Jun 11, 2015 4:15 pm

Umm quote a lot to think about here The Mary WEBSTER death is definitely out as "MY" Mary remarried and died as Mary Matley in Repton in 1877. There are other trees on An..ry giving a marriage of Joseph to Mary ROUND in 1828 needless to say none has an exact place or date for the marriage and none mention the earlier children only those which appear on the 1841 census...now that is interesting where were Sarah 1816,Ann 1818,Harriet 1822 and Elizabeth 1825 all baptised in Repton but not on the 1841 census now is this a big clue that there were two Joseph and Mary Websters in Repton 1816- 1839 Did Mary Brown first marry a ROUND worth a look I think
Thank you for the discussion it may well lead us to the truth.
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby sdup26 » Fri Jun 12, 2015 11:03 am

No answers I'm afraid, just observations. When Mary re-married in 1849, she said her father was John Brown, labourer. As she was born around 1797, he could have been still alive in 1849, and working as a labourer, possibly in agriculture. In an earlier post, you say it’s doubtful a trained tradesman would become a labourer, but it’s not unlikely. There was no old age pension, and labouring (which could be odd jobs here and there) may have been all an older man could manage, however skilful he may have been at his old trade.
It doesn’t follow that John was a labourer when she was born. Soldiers and sailors could have their wives travelling with them - officially, the Admiralty didn’t allow wives on board, but Captains often did, so John may have been a seaman. A woman had no home or money while her husband was at sea, so travelling with him made some sense, and childbirth at sea wasn’t uncommon. Unfortunately, online records for births at sea don't start until the 1850’s, but the Browns may have waited to reach home before having Mary baptised.
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby nuttree » Fri Jun 12, 2015 2:20 pm

I just wish i knew where she lived if we could find a marriage to Joseph Webster it will help enormously. I have been looking for a Mary Brown marrying a Mr Round in case she is the Mary ROUND who married Joseph in 1828 It would be good to see the entry for that marriage to see if either were widows remarrying but none of the An..try trees have an exact date and place just 1828 Derbyshire for the Mary Round marriage. I have tried Free Reg FMP and An..try, for Staffordshire, Leicestershire and Derbyshire for a Joseph Webster to a Mary marriage with out finding one for either Brown or Round. Can anyone see one please or sugest where else I can try looking.
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby sdup26 » Fri Jun 12, 2015 5:44 pm

If you haven’t tried it, Dusty Docs (www.dustydocs.com) is great for parish records, including many from local sources that don’t appear on the major sites.
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby nuttree » Sat Jun 13, 2015 12:13 pm

Many thanks for the reminder of Dusty Docs I have been through the Derbyshire marriage index there with no joy I wonder if they married in Staffordshire or Leicester or indeed did they marry. I am beginning to think this is going to remain a strong brick wall
Last edited by nuttree on Sun Jun 14, 2015 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby sdup26 » Sat Jun 13, 2015 6:02 pm

You're right to consider searching neighbouring counties, but as you know, a great many parish records still aren't online. So apologies if you've done this, but have you tried the relevant local family history societies, which often have their own databases? If you've done all that and still can't find a marriage, you may have to accept that there isn't one to find.
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby sdup26 » Mon Jun 15, 2015 5:53 pm

Still no luck with a Webster/Brown marriage, but earlier, you asked where were Sarah b1816, Ann 1818, Harrriet 1822, and Elizabeth 1825? All born Repton but not on the 1841 census.

In 1841, I think Harriet is a female servant at Connigree House, Etwall, Burton-on-Trent. (About 3 miles from Repton) Also close to Repton is Willington, where in 1841, an Elizabeth Webster b1826 was a female servant.

However, there’s also a death entry for Elizabeth Webster, christened 16 Jan 1825 in Repton, died March 14 1834, parents Joseph and Mary. Is this your Elizabeth, rather than the one above, or more evidence of two Joseph & Mary Websters in the Repton area, as suggested in your post of June 11th?
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby nuttree » Mon Jun 15, 2015 10:32 pm

Thank you for your continued interest I am sorry not to reply earlier I have been tied up with work today and will be tomorrow I hope to answer fully Wednesday
Regards Nuttree
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby nuttree » Fri Jun 19, 2015 9:34 am

Sorry for the delay in replying things got a bit hectic here
I think I now have marriages for two of the older sisters
I had one under my nose all the time ! Ann WEBSTER married John PARKER 28 Jan 1840 SaintWerburgh,Derby, she and John are with mother Mary in 1841 HO107/ 192/4 fo51 p16
The other one I have was Harriet she married Edward WATTS 15 Oct 1844 in Aston and was living in Castle Bromwich in 1851.
I have taken the Elizabeth death in 1834 as a stong contender. So that only leaves Sarah unaccounted for at the moment, and sadly gets me no further in the search for Mary Brown.Not sure wich of the neighbouring counties to start with in the search
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Re: Born at Sea

Postby sdup26 » Fri Jun 19, 2015 5:57 pm

If you’ve followed the usual advice to work backwards from yourself, and you’ve arrived at the children of the Mary who was with Joseph Webster then with Matthew Matley, so you know they are your ancestors, you’ve done a lot better than many. Incidentally, you don’t say if you’ve sent for the birth certificate of the last child born to Joseph Webster and Mary (1839) to confirm the mother’s maiden name. (Repton would be covered by the Burton on Trent registration district.)

It’s intensely frustrating not to get back further than Mary herself, and sometimes we have to settle for what we have until more records become available, but it’s the hope that keeps us going! In your case, it’s still possible that ‘born at sea’ was a story, just like the one that said my 2xgt.grandparents were ‘married on the boat from Ireland’ to cover lack of a marriage certificate, when in reality, he was already married. On that point, there’s a Mary Brown, illegitimate child of Elizabeth Brown bpt 5/6/1794, Littleover, about 4 miles from Repton.

As to which adjoining county to search next, why not have a look at dusty docs to see which has the most available records and try that one first.
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