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Postby SDV » Wed May 06, 2015 10:23 am

George Thomas Daniels (1847-1906) was my Great Grandfather. His first wife was Catherine Connelly who died young in 1871. They had two children: Rosina (b1868) and Alice (b1869). I have managed to trace Rosina reasonably well from her birth in Islington in 1868, though her marriage to Thomas Morris in 1899, to her death in 1954 in Islington.

Alice is more of a mystery, her last definite appearance is in the 1891 census, when she was living in Cromwell Road, Islington with her Grandparents, Charles and Eliza Daniels.

It is possible that in 1901 she is living at 38 Retcar Street, St Pancras. If so she is now a charwoman, aged 30. She is living with another charwoman Hellie (Nellie?) TAYLOR, aged 30, and her brother Herbert TAYLOR, a coach painter aged 20.

I don't know whether Alice married or not. Nor do I know when and where she died. I can't even find her in the 1911 census, possibly because she married and changed her name.

Any help would be much appreciated.
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Postby meekhcs » Wed May 06, 2015 11:12 am

Marriage between Alice Daniels (21) and James Bradford 24 Nov 1888 St Jude's Bethnal Green, father George Daniels a blacksmith. Does this fit your family knowledge? Source Ancestry London marriages
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Postby ciderdrinker » Wed May 06, 2015 11:15 am

I've checked out all the marriages 1891-1901 and none are her.There are also no deaths for those dates (or up to 1911)so it does look as though that's her in 1901 lodging in St Pancras.
There is a possible marriage but her age is out by quite a bit
St Judes Bethnal Green
Walter James Stean 21 warehouseman Centre St s of Walter James Stean packer
Alice Lillian Daniels 21 Felix St d of George horse hair dresser
witness Walter James Stean and Frances Stean.
They appear on the 1911 -she as Lillain 27 born Bethnal Green

Again I've checked all the Alice Daniels marriages up to 1911 and no others with a father George.
I don't think it's her as there is a Alice born 1884 d of George and Jemima in Stepney.
Of course she may be living in sin and just changed her surname.
There's a Alice E Daniels death in Edmonton Sep 1918 age 48 could be but difficult to tell.

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Postby SDV » Wed May 06, 2015 11:31 am

Thanks for all the help. I know that it is difficult, as I have tried myself and keep running into problems. There is the possible death mentioned by Ciderdrinker in Edmonton and there is also another one in Q4 1945 in Islington aged 77. As he comments, could be but difficult to tell.

Her father George Thomas was a fishmonger for most of his life, if that helps. He certainly was not a blacksmith, nor was he a horse hair dresser.
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Postby SDV » Wed May 06, 2015 3:40 pm

I like the suggestion of Hettie or Henrietta, but unfortunately still cannot find her in 1911.
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Postby sdup26 » Wed May 06, 2015 3:44 pm

We haven’t established that the Alice living with the Taylors in 1901 is yours, but if she is, and if she doesn’t appear in any other records post-1901, this one may be worth considering:

1911 Census, Epsom, Surrey
A D, Patient, single, aged 42 (b1869), charwoman, birthplace NK, London

(Census Ref: RG14 PN2965 RD31 SD2 ED19 SN9999)
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Postby SDV » Thu May 07, 2015 11:34 am

sdup26 - thanks for the suggestion.

I had been wondering myself about whether her disappearance was due to hospitalisation or being committed to a mental institution. It was the solution to the death of another elderly relative, the clue being that a family member remembered that she suffered from dementia.

So this might be a useful route, as lets face it I have no other viable routes at present. I will need to find out where the records for these institutions are kept and how they can be accessed.
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Postby SDV » Mon Oct 03, 2016 2:37 pm

I wonder if I have found my Alice. I would welcome opinions.

I know from her birth certificate, that Alice DANIELS was born 01 Sep 1869 @ Scholefield Road, Islington. Her father was George Thomas DANIELS, who was a fishmonger, who died in 1906.

The last definite sighting of Alice was the 1891 census, when aged 21 she was working as a general servant and living with her grandparents, Charles and Eliza Daniels @ Cromwell Road, Islington.

There is a speculative sighting of Alice in the 1901 census, when aged 30 she was working as a charwoman and boarding at 38 Retcar Street, St Pancras. She was living with Hettie TAYLOR (32), another charwoman, who was born in St Pancras, and Hettie's brother, Herbert TAYLOR (20), a coach painter, born St Pancras.

After much searching, I have found a marriage between Philip James CANNELL and Alice DANIELS on 26 Jan 1918 at St Thomas in Camden Town. He was a widower, aged 64, living at 52 Rochester Road. His father is Charles CANNEL (dcd).

She was a spinster aged 45, also living at 52 Rochester Road. Her father is given as George William DANIELS, a fishmonger. The age of 45 allowing for the lowering often found on marriage certificates is in the right range, given she was born in September 1869. The father is very tempting apart from the wrong middle name. Since both were fishmongers, could George William be a mistaken George Thomas? The George William on the marriage certificate isn't declared deceased, though George Thomas died in 1906. I'm not sure how connected Alice was to her father, after all she was from his first marriage. George Thomas re-married and had a further 10 children, Alice was last recorded living with her father and step-mother in the 1881 census, when she was 11.

I have located Alice CANNELL in 1939 register living in 24 Warrender Road, Islington. She is widowed and her DOB is given as 01 Sep 1869, which is bang on for Alice DANIELS.

Alice CANNELL dies in Mar 1953 in Islington.

I would welcome any suggestions as to how to go about proving that Alice Cannell was Alice Daniels.
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Postby Sylcec » Wed Oct 05, 2016 3:39 am

Looks like some good research work done there!
The only comment I have for you is to NOT read anything into the fact that Alice's father is not declared as 'deceased' on her marriage certificate. There was no requirement to show whether the father was alive or dead, just to provide the name.
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