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George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

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Re: George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

Postby Robbie J N » Sat Apr 13, 2019 12:25 pm

Replying to Ian Bee.
Thank you. I think that record is correct because the son is R J Oliver, not P J as transcribed on Ancestry, and his age matches. I think Frederick had died by then, and Maria was married. I will now have to investigate which son the grandson Henry came from, it was not R J. Plus, George is listed as a widower, which matches his wife's death in 1879.
Thanks again.

(Sometimes using the '?' and the '*' does not really help much on Ancestry searches!)

Quick addition:
Henry Thomas Oliver, born 1871 Q3, was the son of Thomas Henry Oliver and Harriet Winson, married 27th September 1870.
(They had 10 children, confirmed on 1911 census, that I have found on the GRO, including strangely a Herbert Mountford Oliver, which links to a different thread I had called 'Several Post-1837 Problems' #5!)

Plus - William and Henry Anning might not be the children of Frances, they could be her nephews or something similar, though not likely to be her younger brothers. Her mother Elizabeth would have most likely been too old to be their mother, more likely their grandmother, as she was born about 1788, according to the 1851 census.
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Re: George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

Postby MoVidger » Sat Apr 13, 2019 4:49 pm

According to one of Frances Anning's 1815 baptism records (Wiltshire, England, Church of England Births and Baptisms, 1813-1916), her father James' occupation was 'Officer of Excise'.

TNA hold Entry Papers (CUST 116) for Excise records for the years 1820-1870. A shame because Entry Papers contain a letter of recommendation giving name, age, birthplace, marital status, and a character reference, and a letter from the training officer regarding proficiency in writing, spelling and arithmetic.

TNA also have Minute Books 1695-1867 (CUST 47) which list Excise men’s postings; and Pay Lists for the English Excise 1705-1835 (T44).
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Re: George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

Postby MoVidger » Sat Apr 13, 2019 5:35 pm

There's an 3 August 1817 baptism for a George Oliver in Southampton. Parents Alexander & Maria Oliver. No birth year or birthplace indicated in the record. Probably not your George, but noted that he was residing in Shirley (near Southampton) by 1841; and that he named two daughters "Maria".
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Re: George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

Postby ksouthall » Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:07 pm

MoVidger wrote:According to one of Frances Anning's 1815 baptism records (Wiltshire, England, Church of England Births and Baptisms, 1813-1916), her father James' occupation was 'Officer of Excise'.

TNA hold Entry Papers (CUST 116) for Excise records for the years 1820-1870. A shame because Entry Papers contain a letter of recommendation giving name, age, birthplace, marital status, and a character reference, and a letter from the training officer regarding proficiency in writing, spelling and arithmetic.

TNA also have Minute Books 1695-1867 (CUST 47) which list Excise men’s postings; and Pay Lists for the English Excise 1705-1835 (T44).


Thanks for this, MoVidger. I have an ancestor described as an "Excise man" in the parish register entry for his marriage in 1770. I don't know when or where he was born so it's possible these records might give me a clue or allow me to trace his movements.
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Re: George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

Postby Robbie J N » Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:01 am

Following on from James Anning's profession, there is a marriage from 30th June 1841 in London between a William Anning and Sarah Elizabeth Rix. William's father's name was James Anning and his profession was 'Exciseman'. It does not say that James was deceased, which he most likely was before the 1841 census if this is the same man as Frances' father.
William could possibly be a brother to Frances Ann Anning. (Several trees on Ancestry, which include this marriage between William and Sarah, have no indication of a sister called Frances Ann, but that does not mean that much, though they do have his mother as Elizabeth. There are many irregularities with the ages and deaths of the parents, so of little help.)
Have yet to find a couple called William and Sarah Anning in the 1851 census living in London. (So far, only in Devon.)
Also, William was listed as a 'Baker' on the marriage record, and on the 1841 census a William Anning, baker, was listed as living with a Henry Anning, both 25, and a Sarah Rix, aged 20. William and Henry both not born in county of Middlesex/London.

What are the chances that William and Henry could both be brothers of Frances?
This seems all there is to go on at the moment.
Can anyone provide any other answers?
Still no closer to finding the marriage of George and Frances.
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Re: George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

Postby elsabels » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:09 pm

Birth entry for George Wm Oliver, this could be the child listed on the 1841 census as George Oliver aged 15 months

OLIVER, GEORGE WILLIAM ANNING
GRO Reference: 1840 M Quarter in SOUTH STONEHAM UNION Volume 07 Page 177

Applying for this certificate may give you further information about the couple
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Re: George Oliver & Frances Anning - Marriage 1830s?

Postby Robbie J N » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:21 pm

That would be the correct record, as I listed it earlier, because his exact birth date was 22nd February 1840, according to his Christening record.
All English birth records I have obtained give no details of the parent’s marriage, unlike Scottish records which list the date and place of marriage of parents.

The closest I have gotten is a ‘George Olliver’ and a ‘Fanny King’, but that is not right, as that couple is found on later census records.
Still looking for George Oliver and Frances Ann Anning, they must be listed somewhere.

Plus, I know I mentioned this in another thread, but the 1861 census record for the family has not been found.
This thread has helped to find the 1881 census record for George, his son Robert James and his grandson Henry Thomas. (According to the 1911 census Henry Thomas Oliver and his wife had had 14 children, of which I have found 11 birth listings on the GRO, plus 2 more born in late 1911 and 1915. That is a new record for any of my relatives, 16 children, at least!)

Thanks again for the continued help.
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