Moderator Control Panel ]


A problem shared is a problem halved. Post your brick walls here and see whether you can offer advice to others


Postby SDV » Wed Jun 27, 2018 9:40 am

I suddenly realise that I need help with the above person, having just received PDFs for both her birth and death. I assumed that I had the right person, but now believe both to be wrong.

To start with, I know that Mary Ann WEEDEN, a spinster, aged 18, married John Albert MARDELL in 1873 at St James the Great in Bethnal Green. Her father was named as Frederick Weeden, a bricklayer. I have both John and Mary Ann in the 1881C (RG11 1388 49 33) and the 1891C (RG12 1081 50 35). In 1881 Mary Ann was born in Shoreditch and in 1891 in Middlesex.

Now to the confusion about her birth. I believe - or perhaps believed - that I had her in both the 1861C (RG9 319 79 62) and 1871C (RG10 1341 11 14).

In 1861, the family were living at 10 Virginia Row in Bermondsey. Her father Frederick WEEDEN (52) was an unemployed bricklayer, b Marylebone. Her mother Mary A WEEDEN (41) was also b Horsleydown, Surrey. Whilst Mary Ann herself was 6, b Shoreditch.

In 1871, the family were living at Claremont Place, Edmonton. Her father FrederickR WEEDEN (32) was a shoe binder, b Horsleydown, Surrey. Her mother Mary A WEEDEN (31) was still b Horsleydown, Surrey. Whilst Mary Ann herself was 16, b Shoreditch.

I believe that the family in 1861 is the same one as in 1871 as the some of the siblings match up: Walter (11 & 21), William (4 & 14).

This all led me to believe that the Mary Ann WEEDEN b 01 May 1854 in Brackley Street,Cripplegate was my Mary Ann (Q2 1854 East London 1c 31). But this turned out to be wrong. The father Frederick Weeden was a toymaker, so very wrong occupation, whilst the mother was named Elizabeth rather than Mary Ann. So I have now have no idea where to find her actual birth certificate or indeed baptism.

To compound matters, I am also wrong about her death. Mary Ann does not appear on the 1901 census with John, leading me to believe that she died between 1891 and 1901. So the death on 14 Feb 1898 (Q1 1898 Edmonton 3a 215) seemed ideal - right name, right location and right time range. Unfortunately it is wrong. This Mary Ann MARDELL is the wrong age, 55 rather than 43, and the widow of Thomas MARDELL, a carpenter. My. Mary Ann's husband was always an agricultural labourer.

Re-examing the evidence, I now see that John was not described as a widower in 1901, but rather as married. By 1911, he was a widower. So perhaps a different time range for her death.

Any help in locating the correct birth/baptism and death/burial would be welcomed.
Posts: 488
Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2015 4:47 pm

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby trace » Wed Jun 27, 2018 11:53 am

Have you identified the marriage of her parents?

The 1861 Census 10 Virginia Row has Frederick age 32 and a Shoemaker.....
Last edited by trace on Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:50 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Posts: 126
Joined: Mon Oct 05, 2015 7:40 pm

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby Mick Loney » Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:01 pm

For future reference, try the new GRO website for births and deaths pre-1917.

1. Births show mothers maiden name. You can check for potential births for Mary Ann, and then find potential matching marriage for her father, using mothers maiden name (careful if she was widow when they married, as marriage entry would be registered under her married name).
With mothers maiden name, you could also look for siblings, born either side of Mary Ann, helpful for finding matching households or eliminating incorrect ones.

2. Deaths show age at death, so you could have confirmed this was correct death by checking age before ordering :D

You could also use FamilySearch, to locate potential christenings for Mary Ann, which would give you the mothers forename.

When I get back to my PC, I’ll have a closer look.
Mick Loney
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:39 am

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby Mick Loney » Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:09 pm

Follow Up

Frederick Roberts Weeden (widower) married Mary Ann Southey, 5th Feb 1849 at St Marylebone. Although he was a bootmaker, his father was a bricklayer. Mary Ann's father was John Southey Fruiterer.

In 1861, Frederick shown as a Shoemaker, and they were with their children
John 1843 (from Fredericks first marriage)
Walter 1850
Mary A 1855
William 1857
GRO entry for Walter and William confirm mothers maiden name was Southey. I can find no entry for Mary Ann

in 1871, Frederick is now shown as a Bricklayer, and their children included
Walter 1850
Mary A 1855
William 1857
Jane 1862
Arthur 1864
Entries for Jane and Arthur confirm mothers maiden name was Southey

Sadly, I can still can't find a birth registered for Mary Ann, but am reasonably confident these are her parents

NB Mary Ann & John Mardell had a son John Southey Mardell, registered in 1879, which I think confirms that Mary Ann Southey was Mary Ann's mother!

Still looking for her death
Mick Loney
Posts: 723
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:39 am

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby sdup26 » Wed Jun 27, 2018 3:46 pm

Mick beat me to it! As he found, Mary Ann's assumed siblings - Walter, William, Jane Evaline and Arthur, are all listed with mother's maiden surname Southey, which fits with the marriage of Frederick Roberts Weedon, bootmaker, widower, to Mary Ann Southey in 1849, but apparently not Mary Ann.
Posts: 1517
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 4:34 pm

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby elsabels » Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:38 pm

Check the witnesses on the 1873 marriage cert , they could be relatives!

Death entry out of your time frame
Mardell Mary A 1857 1924 1924 England & Wales Deaths 1837-2007 Edmonton, Middlesex
Posts: 348
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:09 pm

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby ianbee » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:03 pm

June qtr 1891 Edmonton 3a 428
Mardell, Constance Ruth
mother's maiden surname Weeden

What became of her?
No idea, so I had a look at an ancestry family tree (sorry!)
All it said was that she was the daughter of John Albert Mardell and Mary Ann Weedon, that she had a daughter Ivy born in 1908, and that she died in Northolt (when?)
This looks like the daughter
March 1908 Kensington 1a 109
Humphrey, Ivy Clarissa Margaret
mother —

I don't know if they are barking up the wrong tree. Looking for these people in the census (info not on the tree) they are probably in the Portobello Road
In 1901 Mary Humphrey says she was born in Bermondsey. Daughter Ruth, 10, born Edmonton.

And in 1911 Mary Humphrey says that she has been married 18 years, 9 children born alive, 9 living and one died! Which doesn't really make any sense.
Mary Ann Humphrey Wife 51
Constance Humphrey Daughter 20
John Robert Humphrey Head 64
Ivy Humphrey Daughter 3
all born England

The implication of all this appears to be that Mary Ann Mardell left her husband and family to live with with Mr Humphrey (but taking Constance Ruth)
So you have to decide whether it looks worth investigating.
Posts: 2451
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:51 pm

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby ianbee » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:28 pm

From electoral registers we can see that Constance Ruth must have married Leonard Alfred Hodgson (in 1911)
By the way, the tree says Mary Ann died in 1927.
Posts: 2451
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:51 pm

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby ianbee » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:43 pm

In danger of losing the plot here!
Sep 1919 Kensington 1a 563
Burchett, Charles W. - spouse Mardell
Mardell, Mary A. - spouse Burchett

When did John Albert Mardell die? Mr Humphrey is no longer at 387 Portobello after the war, and Mary Ann Humphrey not listed after 1919, but 1920 has Charles William and Mary Ann Burchett!

There's a report in the West London Observer, 6 Feb 1925
A RECORD OF VIOLENCE. Charlee Wm. Burchett, 48, mechanic, was charged with being drunk and disorderly in Portobello Road, Notting Hill, on Saturday evening, and with assaulting Leonard Alfred Hodgson, painter and decorator of 387, Portobello Road. Mr. Pierron prosecuted. It seemed that the accused went to that address, where his wife carried on a business and made a disturbance. Prosecutor—his step-daughter's husband —tried to persuade him to go away, and defendant dealt him a blow in the face with his fist.......

Is this the death alluded to in the mysterious tree?
March 1927 Kensington 1a 339
Burchett, Mary Anne
age 67

Probate for her ... 2#calendar

Died 10 March 1927
of 387 Portobello Road
Wife of Charles William Burchett
Probate to George John Jary, carman!
Posts: 2451
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:51 pm

Re: Mary Ann WEEDEN

Postby ianbee » Wed Jun 27, 2018 11:16 pm

ianbee wrote:When did John Albert Mardell die?

Death, June 1917 Edmonton 3a 619
Mardell, John Albert
age 69

So two years before the marriage of Mary A Mardell in Kensington!
Posts: 2451
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:51 pm


Return to General research queries

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest